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Speak Out 7/15/08

Tuesday, July 15, 2008

Fix the streets

CITY COUNCIL, I bought a scooter a couple of months ago. Since then, I've seen more and more scooters on the road, as well as more and more people on bicycles and motorcycles. I don't know if you've noticed, but the streets of Cape Girardeau are full of potholes. It's bad on everybody's cars, and it's dangerous for us. So how about taking the money for that water park and using it to fix the streets instead?

Board cooperation

IT'S NO wonder the Cape Girardeau School Board can't come up with long-term facilities and finance plans when the members battle for an hour over the name for an alternative school. It's time for board members to put on the big-kid pants. Cape Girardeau needs you to put aside your petty differences and get something done.

Gordonville safety

I ALSO drive through Gordonville every morning and afternoon, and I must respectfully disagree with the longtime Gordonville resident who claims there is no speeding problem there. That comment raised a troubling point, though. I've always heard Gordonville is a safe, quiet community. Yet this comment says the town needs two officers at night to keep the residents safe. That's an awful lot for that small area. What in the world is going on out there at night?!

Teaching dilemma

THOSE OF you who are complaining about the kids in your neighborhood now know what teachers in public schools are up against. By the time a kindergarten teacher gets a class of kids, they are about 5 years old, the age at which experts agree their personalities are fully formed. After that point, they can still change, but it takes time and, most of all, consistence. Teachers cannot teach 25-plus kids and at the same time fix the behavioral, ethical and social problems kids are coming to school with these days. There are solutions, but when they're brought up there's a hue and cry from groups such as the ACLU. I used to love teaching, but now I merely like it. It's not the kids. It's our society, which doesn't hold people accountable, and parents who don't want to do the work that real parenting demands.

Childhood innocence

LET'S BE realistic. I bet everyone who thinks that the 1950s were a wonderful, idyllic time of innocence was a child during those years. The world has always been the same. When you are a child, you are innocent, so the rest of the world seems that way from your perspective. As you get older you come to realize that the world is full of liars and cheaters, and you become cynical and long for those sweet, innocent days. My grandma spoke of the innocent days of the teens. My parents remembered the 1940s. To me the 1960s were pure and ideal relative to my childhood. My kids will undoubtedly look back on the 1990s in the same way. Instead of wishing for days gone by, let's stop complaining about today and make tomorrow better.

Nation of whiners

I BELIEVE U.S. Sen. Phil Gramm is correct. We have become a nation of whiners. People seem to expect the government to take care of them from cradle to grave. Whatever happened to pride, honor and trust? They seem to be the real endangered species.

A good deed

I WANT to thank the young man from Marble Hill who changed my tire in the Saint Francis Medical Center parking lot. You were a lifesaver. My son was sick. We had been to the doctor, and then had a flat. Thank you for coming to our rescue. I will return the nice deed to someone else who needs my help.

Sunshine Law

I WAS appalled to read that the Cape Girardeau County Board of Park Commissioners and the Enhanced 911 Advisory Board both held meetings that violated the Sunshine Law. I will fully expect to see Morley Swingle holding a press conference to ask for the attorney general's office to investigate these wrongdoings. I suspect this will not happen, though, unless the park board or 911 board try to have Swingle's books taken off of the county Web site as 2nd District Cape Girardeau County Commissioner Jay Purcell tried to do.

Low gas average

SNAP OUT of your mental recession. Missouri has the lowest average gas price in the nation. Quit whining.

Personal responsibility

BILLIONAIRE OILMAN T. Boone Pickens is leading the charge in weaning us off dependency on foreign oil by developing wind and solar power. That should be a clear signal to you that the whole oil dependency problem is our fault and that each of us should publicly accept personal responsibility.

Hall of fame

DR. JIM Welker is a great guy and will be a great Cape Girardeau School District superintendent. I am 100 percent confident that he will see to it that there is immediate restoration of Cape's athletic hall of fame.

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Nation Of Whiners -

Really I'd only like the government to take care of me only 10% as well as it took care of Phil Gramm. Gramm was raised on the Federal Disability checks that his father got, spent most of his life on the payrolls of either public universities or the US Senate and the majority of his families wealth is thanks to his role passing laws to directly benefit companies that his wife sat on the boards of (most prominently Enron). Now as an old man Gramm earns a living whining for the government to to lend a helping hand to whichever company pays him the most as a lobbyist. Cradle to Grave indeed.

-- Posted by Nil on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:14 AM

Former Senator Gramm has no idea what the every day working family man is up against out here. Some people that are wealthly never cease to amaze me since most of them never have been in the trenches in the first place.

-- Posted by swampeastmissouri on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 6:41 AM

Gas prices

Have to agree with this caller, prices here in Missouri are cheaper than the surrounding areas so it could always be worse


Makes me think of what my Mom always said. "keep up the whining and I'll give you something to whine about"


When the schools have to put 25+ kids in a classroom they are going to act out but more and more parents are sending their kids to school and expecting the school to deal with it. They do not want the kids havinghomework because that gets into their time. I like my kids school, the classes average 15 kids a class so even if a teacher has a kid that acts out they have more time to help that child. Same with around the neighborhood send them to play with friends and then the parent doesn't have to deal with them. We had an 8 yo little girl at our house all day up until 9 last night that the mother didn't even know where she was but never tried to find out either and acted like it was a burden when we finally took her home. Makes me wonder why some people even have kids.

Now good morning all.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 7:35 AM

Who Me said: He pad his own college if his dad was on disability.

And you know this how? BTW - it's paid, not pad.


-- Posted by motrans on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:14 AM

Here's a memory from the "innocent 60s" that I will never forget.

My father and I (then about 11 years old) stood outside our southern California home in October 1962. We had just watched President Kennedy give his "Cuban missile crisis speech". As we stood in the warm twilight of that clear fall evening, we heard thunder coming from somewhere over the mountains just north of our home. I asked my dad what it was, saying it scared me. He said it was just heat lightning and not to be afraid. His words, however, did not erase my fear that any moment Russian bombs would be falling out of that sky. Perhaps that was the day I lost my innocence and the world became a scary place.

-- Posted by Observer1 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:22 AM

If a parent is on disability then chances are college tutition was paid with pell grants and other financial aide. Those with a low income, and disabilty is that, qualify for the assistance those with above average incomes or two parents that work don't. A lot of people get help to go to college as long as they learn and make it what does it matter.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:31 AM

Isn't it becoming quite cliché to call anyone who complains a whiner. I suppose King George said the same things about those Colonists and their complaints about taxation without representation.

This whining thing is simply talk radio fodder.

-- Posted by SWBG on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:38 AM

SWBG wrote: This whining thing is simply talk radio fodder.

Couldn't have said it better myself!


-- Posted by motrans on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:05 AM


Whinning is only whinning if you don't agree with the person making the statement. It is taking a stand if you agree with the statement.

example: I used to take home 80 percent of my paycheck before the Bush tax cuts, now I take home 75 percent. Taking a stand if you believe it, whinning if you don't.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:09 AM


I do indeed recall those tense 14 days on October 1962.

Yep those drills in school to get under your desk in case of a nuclear blast.I guess they wanted us comfortable when we got vaporized.I prefer the militaries drill in case of nuclear exposion.Bend down with your head between your legs and kiss your *** goodbye!I also recall a great speach by then outgoing President Eisenhower who so graciously warned us as a Nation of what would happen if we let the "Military Industrial Complex" get out of control.Well,some 48 years later it seems we did NOT listen!

-- Posted by GREYWOLF on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:11 AM

Babe (from yesterday),

Thanks for the info. I can see the Fed. government looking at Gov. Arnold and going "nah nah nah, were going to allow drilling off the coast of Calif and you can't do anything about it." Kind of puts State's rights into perspective don't it?? lol

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:12 AM

I remember back in the 80's when was at camp we had the radio on and we were all being told to take cover we were under attack. 120 screaming 11 and 12 year old girls were all crying wanting our moms, the leaders were freaked out and then about 3 hours later it came out over the radio it was a drill and to think about what you would have done if it were real.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:15 AM


I remember some guys on KSHE 95 out of St. Louis doing something like that. However I was in college during the 80's so my recollections are a bit fuzzy. I am quite sure I have forgotten more of the 80's than I remember. All I really remember is bad hair and bad music!

-- Posted by SWBG on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:22 AM


I am not sure where the station was I just know it scared the heck out of all of us. Now all of the music wasn't bad but got to admit when look back the hair was pretty awful and the clothes.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:25 AM

morning everyone what have I missed, looks like I have to read quite a few comments, to catch up on.


-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:25 AM

Morning Twiggy

You haven't missed much

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:27 AM

good morning everyone

-- Posted by ..Rick on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:31 AM

morning rick

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:32 AM

Fix the streets:

Well, since you insist on bringing up the water park again...SURF THE SLUDGE SLIDE!!! Sorry, just couldn't help myself.

Charter subscribers: Today's the day those ole fashioned thingies, phones I think they were referred to, are supposed to go down for whatever reason. If so, make sure your cell phones are charged.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:54 AM


Re: Whining

Well you present food for contemplation, to me "whining" is whining whether you agree or disagree with the subject. I know people who never whine no matter what and others who make a profession of it so it seems. I know a man who has been in a wheel chair since he was eighteen and now in his fifties with ongoing health problems; never hear him whine and he works every day.

Only my opinion, but the ratio of whiners to non whiners is on the upswing.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:06 AM

SWBG and Semo,

Aaaah now come on. The big hair for girls and mullets for boys were cool back then. And who could forget the great music of Duran Duran, Adam Ant, Journey, Flock of Eagles and the Eurithmics (sp). And lest we forget the dances of the pongo and slam dancing. And who didn't have at least 3 swatch watches?? And don't forget Reagan single handedly saving Democracy. Walter Mondale's where's the Beef? And back then if you saw Arnold on the tv it was in a comedy or action adventure, not a political speach. Oh the good ole days of my youth.

Man I feel old now or very Californian. lol

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:08 AM


not old just to much CA


-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:10 AM


You're going to give me a complex. You are always picking apart my rational with more rational thoughts. First my post of perspective now whinning. You're gonna make me have to think. How very wrong of you. LMAO

*Big J/K here!!*

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:12 AM


I guess it holds true then. You can take the boy out of California, but you can't take the California out of the boy. hehe

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:15 AM

pups, do you mean flock of seagulls?

-- Posted by all_i_hear_is_blah_blah on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:16 AM


You can't imagine how proud I am of you to acknowledge that Ronald Reagan single handedly saved democracy. I see my work here is done ;-)

My son is probably your age and I remember his astonishment when he began to hear his favorite songs on classic or "geezer" rock stations.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:26 AM

i think i'll start a whinery with whine made from

the finest grapes grown in Missouri .

throw in a little cheese on the side and i should

have all the customers i could hope for ...

-- Posted by ..Rick on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:35 AM

Just a word of friendly advice.

If anyone has more than $100,000 in the bank you had better get it out as the Fed won't insure more than that. The Indymac Bank thing won't be the only bank to fail. Needless to say I don't have to make any withdrawals for this reason.

-- Posted by SWBG on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:46 AM

Gee, the semi-dark Prophet of Change (PC; what's his face...B.O., Hussein? Whatever) - for him, change being flip-flopping like a beached mackerel - is divining his strategy for surrenduring the WOT as I type. Of course, he dismisses Iraq as irrelevant regarding the WOT, and therefore plans to retreat from there, notwithstanding that little matter of 550 metric tons of yellowcake discovered in Iraq by our troops, who had the headache of having to guard it until secure logistics could be arranged to secretly move it out.

Funny thing. As a former nuke guy, I always had a nervous gut hunch that there was for sure a real "N"BC WMD program in Iraq which, even funnier, the drooling leftist propaganda machine is still unwilling to discuss honestly, including our marxian PC guy. Go figure. Heck, I've been waiting for days to hear a tweet out of even the local lefty dweebs about the yellowcake thing in Iraq...not surprised I didn't hear jack though.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:54 AM

I don't have to worry either, probably will never have even close to that amount.


-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:54 AM

Isn't there an old saying the rich get richer and the poor get poorer?


-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:55 AM

May have to spend the rest of the day going from bank to bank.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:56 AM


Yeah, I meant Flock of Seagulls, have no idea why I put Eagles. Well, except I love their music also. My fingers were typing faster then my head I guess. Sorry about that.

And Instructor,

Don't play innocent, I know you listened to them and rocked out in your bed room. LMAO j/k


Sorry to say your work will never be done here. There will always be something you are going to have to educate me on. What can I say?? I'm a Liberal and I'm slow to learn. (just a joke, no one has to agree!!!) hehe

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:58 AM

Unfortunately, if you have more than 100k in the bank, you are very, very far from being rich.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:59 AM


I thought the Feds only insured up to $100,000 already. And agreed, won't be making any mad rushes to the bank here either.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:00 PM

i'm only a hundredaire , not a thousandaire

or millionaire ...i think i'm safe from the

bank issues ...

once i get my Whinery going , this may change !

-- Posted by ..Rick on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:02 PM


The Yellow cake found was planted by the buddies of the President and Vice President in accordance to the New World Order. Didn't you get the memo???

*Major J/K, don't skin the Pup*

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:05 PM


Wouldn't want you any other way. When I get to the point that I do not appreciate differing points of view or am unwilling to listen to others' ideas with an open mind it will be a sad day indeed. While I know it seems outrageously implausible, I have been wrong a time or two and actually changed my mind.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:08 PM


Make what you want of it.


I particularly like this from the article:

The yellowcake removed from Iraq - which was not the same yellowcake that President George W. Bush claimed, in a now discredited section of his 2003 State of the Union address, that Saddam was trying to purchase in Africa - could be used in an early stage of the nuclear fuel cycle. Only after intensive processing would it become low-enriched uranium, which could fuel reactors producing power. Highly enriched uranium can be used in nuclear bombs.

Looks as if it was a far cry from a weapon of mass destruction.

-- Posted by SWBG on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:24 PM


Actually, this yellowcake find is not exactly a "J/K" or laughing matter. In fact, let me attempt to blow your shorts off by saying something a bit "extreme" here, not to confound anyone into thinking I've morphed into a flaming leftist, or something. When I think about it, I can somewhat side with the other Hussein guy, not the "PC" Hussein "community takes-a-village organizer" guy...I think his name was Saddam. I actually think ole Saddam was expediting his WMD program, including the big "N" in NBC weapons to counter the nuke threat from Iran.

Oh, wait. There's no threat that Iran has or will have nukes soon either, according to "PC" Hussein, 'cause he'll send his top negotiating team of "under-the-covers" Plame & her dog, Joe, to Neville Chamberlain them out of even thinking about obtaining them, let alone using them. Right?

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:34 PM

Yeah, probably should have waited until they had nuclear capabilities, makes much more sense.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:38 PM

Well time to go for a bit. It's been fun. Not the least bit boring. Everyone have a great day.


Discussion is always welcome and incouraged. And, yes we may not always agree, but the respect is there.


Sign me up for the first tour once you get up an running. Nothing better on a nice Summer day then to have a bit of whine and cheese.

And Who Me? be sure not to make too much money today. I might be jealous and have to call you out as being an evil capitalist only out for yourself and not caring for the common man. Though,on the plus side, we still have Instructor's plan of making you continue to spend your profits so he can make some. hehe

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:39 PM

Out for a while too, like Red Rhino I have to go move some money around.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:42 PM


Regarding your source link: International Herald Tribune - The Global Edition of the New York Times rag. Why am I not surprised? Actually, one of my first hints of this issue came via the AP...go figure.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:47 PM


You should call social service and report the eight year girl's mother.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:54 PM


I like that policy. Let's take out every country that has, desires to have, or is thinking of having any type of nuclear intentions.

How about North Korea next? Much further along in any development stage of weapons of mass destruction than likely any country in the middle east. Ruled by a despot basically enslaving his own people. Seems to meet the criteria for invasion...oh wait a minute...North Korea does not sit on top of huge oil reservoirs.

My facetiousness aside as a nation we have got to stop this grip of dependence upon oil from the middle east or we will forever be subject to their whims. If the dependence dies so does the money supply. Without the money supply goes the ability to develop such weapons.

Our national emergency is not the price of gas and what that is doing to increase inflation in this country but rather our own inability to develop alternative resources. Our governments failings in that matter has been not to make it a #1 priority for the past 30 years.

-- Posted by SWBG on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 12:54 PM


I thought everyone on this forum listened to Rush. Oh did you mean Rush as in ditto or like Tom Sawyer?

-- Posted by SWBG on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 1:01 PM

James Nall:

Didn't you get the memo? The Left is Bereft & the Right is Righteous...well, at least it sounds like a good sound bite.

Actually, folks like you and Greywolf are starting to get to me, I think. Even though our Founding Fathers (OK, to indulge in a little PC Nazism, throw in a Mom or two also) meant this nation to be a Representative Republic (democracy being mob-rule and always self-destructs), it looks as though our two major parties are attempting to make their wishes moot.

Trouble is, we can't do much about it prior to Nov. One party, Dem-Socs (or should I start using the DES designation?) is hard-core socialist, while the other, RINOs, are wimp-Alpha cheerleaders for the same. So, bring on the totalitarian socialism now, so real Americans can exercise what's left of their Bill of Rights and eradicate the socialist cancer once and for all...put a stop to this repeat of history nonsense.

There. I've done my patriotic whining contribution for the day...unless I decide to ask, or re-ask a question or two.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 1:04 PM


Per your post at 10:08...

As the person who commented in SO said, you can be accused of waxing nostalgia over the era of your hey day. LOL

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 1:16 PM

I agree that the gas situation has gone flat out nuts, but it's 4.30 a gallon here in upstate New York, and I'd love to have only 4 bucks or less a gallon, that would be nice. How much does it take to fill up a Honda Civic with 4 cylinders and a 10 gallon tank? 40 bucks, and I remember the days when it would only take 20.

Smokers wouldn't like it very much here either. They passed a new tax (I guess an effort to get people to quit smoking by making them go broke). Marlboro's are 7 bucks, Newports are 8 and USA Golds are 5. Be thankful all the way around for everything is cheaper where you are. Gas, Cigarettes, housing, and food is heinous up here.

-- Posted by AngelicEvil on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 1:25 PM


That is the old saying but it is not true. Actually, the rich do get richer but so do the middle class and poor in prosperous times.

An interesting aside is that if a self-made millionaire loses all his money chances are very favorable that he would have made it all back in a few years.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 1:31 PM

Forgot to add something

I think we as Americans have a legitimate reason to "whine" over things such as the housing market, high gas prices, food prices, minimum wage, and those things that are vitally important.

Whining because you sit on your hind end and do nothing while receiving disability and social security when there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with you, like what my dad and his wife do, is horrid and you more deserve to be shot, not whine.

I think he was right and wrong in his comment. Lazy people have no reason to whine, but hard working people who still can't make all their bills and put food on the table have reason to.

Besides, if we didn't whine, politicians would never see a problem in their world. It's thanks to our "whining" they even know how high gas is or that we are having a hard time. They don't work in a low paying job working 8-5, 7 days a week to come home to a crazy house full of kids and then worry about paying for their medical care. Their job as a politician gives them great everything. They have a nice salary free health care, and way more benefits, and it's more than likely that they have a "driver" and do not drive their own vehicle, therefore, do not have to pump 4 bucks into their own gas tank.

You're welcome for the whining Senator.

-- Posted by AngelicEvil on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 1:33 PM

Ok The Wolf will chime in concerning the band "Rush".

Lee,lifeson and Pearl are still rocking the crowds.

This is truely a band that has managed to stay constant

through 4 decades.I was lucky enough to see them several times in the middle 70s.I recall several great

bands from those times like Uriah heep,King Krimson and

the Dead.Yep those were the days my friends when I had just finished my "Uncle Sam" duties and life was good.

Not that it aint good now ofcourse!Or is it?If we could ever get rid of these Demopublicans things might

indeed improve!

-- Posted by GREYWOLF on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 1:43 PM

Pups: Your kidding right? You can't believe ALL the left-wing talk. Planted nukes, really? Was it buried next to the hole where they found Obama Hussein, I meant Saddam.:):):) Aggie

Oh Hi all!!!

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 1:57 PM

Pups: The band escapes my memory, but they sang " I want you to want me", they used to play here at Texas A&M a lot. When I was younger we would go see them. Aggie

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:08 PM

cheap trick!!!

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:10 PM

James Nall

Are you ever going to admit to being a paleoconservative? giggle

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:12 PM


Yes, after all as a nation we have always treated every situation and every country just the same. No sense in taking time to consider the feasibility or consequences of an action, just do it because we have done it before and it worked then.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:12 PM

James Nall:

You're welcome. I suppose I can now refer to myself as a crusty, crude conservative without a party; somewhat like an "ugly American"...albeit my groupies insist I'm so pretty! But if I'm going to bother to vote in Nov, so at least I'll have "whiner rights", I'll be forced to go for the lighter (in two ways) marxian ole white (Navy) fighter jock instead of the marxian Prophet of Change (PC, both interpretations) guy...and, yes, we still have that hideous ole buzzard, the Hilderbeast, circling about for "something to happen" to the "PC" guy, so she can swoop in and install her brand of Stalinism. Either outcome, my artillery is polished and powder is dry...and all well-hidden for the coming big revolution.

Off topic, but still speaking of Navy stuff, I was digging around in the basement a few weeks ago for something I figured you may remember. It's a big thick pub of acronyms, abbreviations, labels, etc, and I think it's called the "DICNAVAB"...talk about an acronym. Anyway, I didn't find it, yet (even though I know the beast is down there), but I did find some other goodies that made me think of you. What I found were some old NAVPERS pubs for sonar operators and technicians...all declassified now, of course. One is for the AN/SQS-29 Sonar system. Does that ring a bell? Can't remember where I "lifted" some of these things, perhaps some of 'em in Key West. Thought you'd get a kick out of this find...if not spark some memories.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:18 PM

Hello Mr. Nall, I guess. I am a conservative. Like you said earlier Left or Right,its all the same.

Remember the old saying about which side to wear a ear ring if you where a male?

Left is right, Right is wrong. Aggie

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:18 PM

Re: Rush

I don't listen to Rush Limbaugh though I have in the past or the band Rush. I don't find Rush L. to be very entertaining or enlightening and I believe has become too self absorbed and self aggrandizing.

I do kind of like the band Bond.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:23 PM

James Nall

Well, buck up, Sir. Modern times are here and there is nothing you can do about it, really. So let's do what we can do to improve our country, however limited. You have a vote and you should work for your chosen candidate. Don't let this chance pass you by else you might see Obama being sworn in as leader of the free world. You owe it to yourself and others who have fallen to protect your rights of freedom.


-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:40 PM


I guess it depends on how you look at the present market. I know a young couple who just bought a very, very nice house and saved over $130,000 because they had worked hard and managed their money wisely unlike the previous owners.

I guess everyone has the “right” to “whine”, but I have seen so many people in really bad situations with sick children or such who did not “whine”, but rather got up every morning and went to work. If one job didn’t pay the bills, they worked two. My son works two jobs and his wife also works and they never “whine” about how hard they have it. I also see a difference in “whining” and voicing opposition to a legitimate greviance.

I share your disdain for career politicians and wish we could return to the day of the “citizen” legislator or politician who had worked in the real world and was going to return upon completion of their service in office.

I know what you mean about gas, we had relative visit from out of state and they could not believe how “cheap” gas was here.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:44 PM


Yeah had to love those mullet haircuts. It is funny to sit and look back at pictures now though I have to ask myself just what were we thinking. As far as the music goes more for ACDC, Kiss, Metalica, Twisted Sister and Ozzy.......my parents hated that stage.


Why call social services and make it even harder on the kid. I am sure her mom would find some way to blame her for it so for now she can just spend her days here and all is well.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:45 PM

Red Rhino

I had family visiting from out of state last month. They were unfamiliar with Cape. They pulled into a gas station (on Independence, I think) and the sign read "2.29" a gallon. They thought they had died and gone to heaven until they realized the station...was closed.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:51 PM

I've morphed into a flaming leftist, or something.

_posted by Herr_Hauptmann

Wow! Are you making a general assumption?

-- Posted by Theorist on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 2:53 PM


There are a couple of station like that in Sikeston. Funny thing is, we were complaining about it being high then. I guess everything is relative.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:00 PM


Unless you take care of this child 24/7 how can you be assured that all is well? By the situation you described, this child is in danger because of neglect. Please make a call to the hotline before we see another headline of tradegy.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:01 PM


Yes we did think it was high then. Funny my daughter is trying to figure out a way to budget her allowance to cover gas in her car she finally came to the conclusion that heaven forbid she will have to get a job to pay for it. She didn't like it much when I told her welcome to the real world.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:02 PM

James Nall:

I can almost understand your position about voting; however, I'm going to exercise my watered-down privilage anyway, just for grins if for no other purpose. Just be ready to fight "them" off, no matter how old and cranky we're getting. And I think I have a fail-safe gig for avoiding that jury duty. Trouble is, now that I'm firmly afflicted with RMS (that retirement stigma, donchaknow?), I'd kinda like to cause a little trouble on a jury now & then...probably wouldn't take me long to get kicked off the jury though!

Ah, that Key West experience. When not engaged in the fun experience, training in how to kill whales and Soviet subs, I had a blast with my green beret cousine and his crazy-for-fun wife. We'd get drunk in some of those crusty KW bars and raise heck in the streets; in the a.m., we'd sober up by poaching/eating them longoosters. What the hey, after what he'd been through, he didn't give a hang whether we got caught or not. Fun times but, of course, I'm more reserved and law abiding now...somewhat.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:06 PM


It's amazing when kids have to start budgeting their own money that they start to realize that money doesn't grow on trees. LOL My kids did the same thing.


-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:06 PM


I do know what you are saying however the dad gets home around 9 and that is when I run the child home. He is a wonderful parent and loves his daughter, when she wakes up then yes she usually ends up back at my house but I do not mind I know she is safe here and she is really a sweet kid. If I ever felt it was unsafe to take her home then yes I would forget calling the hotline and take her straight to the police station. The dad has insisted the mom get help for her depression and such and made it clear he will take the child and leave if she doesn't. Since it is a friend of my kids I feel helping him out until then is the least I can do.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:07 PM


You would have thought we beat her with the reaction she gave to our suggestion she get a job. We bought the car and we pay the insurance and the least she can do is pay for the gas and if she doesn't want to get a job then guess she can keep walking because I refuse to cave in and took the checkbook away from dad to keep him from doing it. As hard as it is to see her growing up she has to do it.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:10 PM


My kids would sure recognize that phrase. They all had to work at some sort of job or the other. My grand daughter is out mowing yards today, so I guess it must have worked. I think it is good for children to work and learn to manage their money. We found they managed "their" money better than "ours".

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:12 PM


I can not say that when was a kid my parents handed me everything and I never worked then when went to college the same thing. It was a huge shock when I was on my own finally and I don't want my kids being that way. I never really appreciated what i had as a kid because I didn't earn it so from early on while we do spoil the kids they still have to earn what they get even if it is nothing but chores around the house.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:15 PM

James Nall:

Almost missed your last post. Hmmm. Constitution Party, huh? I'd joined that same party (I think it was the same one) many moons ago. Seemed like they just kinda dissipated though. Are they firing back up again? Might be something to look back into sometime. Even so, it'd be a moot point for this year, but a new and powerful independent party for real Americans could surely help.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:16 PM

Did everyone see the President's speech this morning. I had to laugh when he made the comment politics was choking good sense.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:18 PM


I'm sure my kids could tale you horror stories of how mean we were to make them pay for their own Ins and gas for their cars. We helped them buy their first car and they were responsible for the rest. If they couldn't afford gas or Ins, it got parked. I should say that by helping them with their first car we gave them a part of down payment, anyway each one got the same amount and pd us back the difference. My parents did the same for us basically, didn't kill me, so thought it wouldn't hurt them either.


-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:25 PM


I have taken classes and read books on parenting as well as raised my own children and I am still not sure I did it the right way. All we can do as parents is our best and always let them know how much we love them.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:27 PM

Lord love a duck...I sure hate to hear folks trying to get out of jury duty. I guess being judged by a jury of your "peers" has gone by the wayside.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:30 PM

For two days someone has dropped in to tell members of this forum how inane and uninteresting we are rather than dazzling us with their superior intellect, wit and wisdom. I anxiously await pearls of wisdom and truth from these two so I can live a more full and productive life.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:33 PM


My avatar is from this month's cover of the New Yorker magazine, as you can see. Why don't you take your complaint to the magazine editors?

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:36 PM


Is there really a right or wrong way to raise kids. To me I see things others do and feel it is wrong while others think I am to hard on my kids. Guess in the end as long as they are happy, healthy, respectable adults then we have done something right.


Mean mom! I happen to know one of your kids has nothing but respect for you and all you have done for her.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:38 PM


The intent of the cover was, according to the New Yorker, satirical in response to the attacks by the "right". From all reports it contains a very favorable article on Obama.

I am not really sure of the meaning of your avatar.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:43 PM

My avatar is from this month's cover of the New Yorker magazine, as you can see. Why don't you take your complaint to the magazine editors?

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, 2:36 pm

I like the avatar - it's a reminder to all of us the low kinda of crap that has been tried againt Obama. Some must be very afraid he'll win or they wouldn't go to all the trouble of making this stuff up. I think the more it's shown, the more it gains for Obama - it reveals weakness on the other side and helps pick up the independent voters. IMHO

-- Posted by DickCheney on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:45 PM


You know it's nice to think that at least one of my kids thinks I did ok by them. I have told them I wasn't perfect, never claimed to be. I also have tired to tell them to learn from my mistakes and try not to do the same things wrong that I did. I do have to say though the one you know has grown up a great deal in the last 2 years and I am very proud of her. We both are and hope that she continues to do so, and more than anything Aggie and I want to see her get her schooling done that she started, so hopefully one day we will see that happen also.

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:48 PM


we were talking about that the other day and I think she will do it. She has it in her head to get it done and if nothing else that alone will get her through it.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 3:50 PM


You are right, no wait, correct, many of us fear that Obama will become president, but only slightly more so than that McCain will. I personally do not ascribe to the “Obama is a Muslim” or any of that other junk going on, I just disagree with his positions on a variety of issues and really don’t think he has the maturity or experience for the office. Of course he would not be the first.


It is with great restraint that I do not violate my dedication to civility on this forum. Whatever one might think about John McCain, he did not seek out communists, he was shot down, grievously injured and taken by force to a communist prison camp. I personally don’t hold anything against anyone for anything they did while in the hands of the enemy. While in your dreams of glory, you may envision yourself as John Wayne, I am afraid reality would find you doing exactly what John McCain and others did only probably worse. I have no illusions of how I would comport myself under a similar situation.

I am guess that while your name is new, you are not.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:11 PM

Also remember that McCain was sent to war under the administration of one of the most liberal/socialist Presidents ever, Lyndon B Johnson.

-- Posted by Instructor_AKA___________ on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, 3:10 pm CDT

Also remember, the Dems inherited that war as I believe they will this one.

-- Posted by DickCheney on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:20 PM


What republican did Johnson inherit the war from? Not challenging you, just curious. While we had "advisors" over there for some time, I didn't think we actually became active until the Kennedy administration.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:26 PM

KCPO...just curious, what is that an acronym for? I am not challenging you nor debating, but I see we have far different views.

-- Posted by Theorist on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:31 PM

KCPO is just something I made up as I was a Parole Officer who worked in Kansas City.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:34 PM

Thanks....makes sense but you don't seem the "city" type. Perhaps you were just transported in. I must work now, but I imagine we will be "discussing and debating" at another time.

-- Posted by Theorist on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:38 PM

November 1955 — Eisenhower deploys the Military Assistance Advisory Group to train the ARVN (South Vietnamese Army). This marks the official beginning of American involvement in the war as recognized by the Vietnam Veterans Memorial.

-- Posted by DickCheney on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:38 PM


Have a good day.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:44 PM


If you are still there those city folk claimed something was wrong with my radio as I didn't "talk right".

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:46 PM


Eisenhower was presidentwhen the advisory meetings started and passed that part on to Kennedy actual US combat forces did not attack until 1965 which was Johnson.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:46 PM


Thanks for the information, I knew our involvement went back quite a ways, but did not realize it went back to 1955. I did not think we became "actively involved" until much later than that. I think we have had advisors in other countries without going to war. It is however obvious you know more about this than I so I won't belabor the point.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:52 PM


John McCain's wounds may have been crudely treated because of his farther's status. Can you not see how severely he is disabled? Fact is this...he was tortured and he refused to leave before others were released in the POW camp.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:55 PM

The man was a POW fine so were many others out there. It should not make him any different than those he served with and was captured with. Keep his POW status seperate from the election as the two have nothing to do with each other.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:58 PM

KCPO: Loved your " ... how inane and uninteresting we are ..." comments!

While looking for a certain comment the other day from another poster, I noticed something: All of the former Mary_Jo's comments seem to be posted as "." now. LOL

grisgris (from yesterday) can't handle the SO comment section if there's no real unpleasantness except his own involved in the discussions? That's so sad ... Rick, your comment about "unbridled grudges against posters" might also give us a faint suspicion that grisgris could quite possibly be someone who has posted under another name. Kind of like the old dime mystery novels sometimes...spotting the almost obvious clues. LOL

semoangel, I hadn't thought of that in decades ... 'Stop your whining or I'll give you something to whine ABOUT.' Thanks for the reminder--I think. LOL SO great of you to watch over that little girl...in an age when so many parents aren't even watching over their own. Your perspective on child-rearing always impresses me!

It appears that with the popularity of the word 'whine," the actual definition has either been forgotten or changed...? ;-) 'WHINE (plural whines): A long-drawn, high-pitched complaining cry or sound; TO WHINE: to complain or protest in a childish manner or about trivial things.'

Great story, Observer, about the coincidence of missile crisis speech and thunder. Can see where something like that could have brought "reality" into a child's way of thinking.

Where in the world have you been, Herr? Missed you--really! Was saving some comments to some of your comments ... Keep that brain exercised here; although it's been interesting lately, it's been a little lacking of your stirring-things-up sense of humor.

In fine form today, aren't you, Pups? Probably didn't need to do the J/K, though ... Red seems to have a handle on recognizing things like that! ;-) Oh, and Red: " ... I have been wrong a time or two and actually changed my mind." Isn't that called flip-flopping? If so, I'm guilty, too. (Sorry, Herr! Just MHO on some flips & flops.)

-- Posted by gurusmom on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:59 PM

DickCheney, Instructor, Semoangel70,

Now I am really confused though I suppose it doesn't really matter now. I do know we were taking casualties as early as 1961 as my brother who was in the service told us about it and no one believed him, so he just quit saying anything about it.


Like I said, I won't judge anyone for anything they said or did in captivity. If McCain got special treatment because his dad was an admiral, I don't really care. Maybe you would have preferred that he had been allowed to die. If you want to judge others, have at it, not my style.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:04 PM


Thank you. Although I do not try to impress with my theory on child raising it is nice to know some who have already went through it agree with what I am doing. I am no where near the perfect parent but I give it my best shot after all the kids didn't ask to be born I chose to have them so it is my responsibility to do the best I can by them. Just hope I can survive!!!!!!!!

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:04 PM


You are not alone. According to the search on Wipeka we did not even start the meetings until early 1960 with ground forces attacking in 65 then it says almost all troops were out in 73 but the end was 75. Mes thinks the history pages need to get it together because i confuse easy enough as it is.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:07 PM

Instructor, KCOP, Cheney,

According to the actual Vietnam Wall it states of the casualties of the war, "They are listed in chronological order, starting at the apex on panel 1E in 1959 (although it was later discovered that the first casualties were military advisers who were killed by artillery fire in 1957)" Sorry Instructor, but you're mistaken according to the Wall.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:10 PM


Sorry, but POW status along with a military record is important in electing a POTUS. Valor and sacrifice is still appreciated by voters. We can be assured that McCain will continue to fight the WOT because he understands of freedoms lost if we do not.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:10 PM

Oh Aggie,

I wasn't being serious earlier about the Yellowcake comment. Just me being a smart butt and having a little fun.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:11 PM


I just don't understand why someone would take the time to read all of this if it was not of some interest on some level, I would just quit and go on my way without feeling compelled to say anything.

I think we have some very interesting and diverse writers on here across the political spectrum. You don't have to agree with someone to be impressed by their intellect.

I have violated my policy of not posting too much today, so I will stop now. Everyone have a good day.

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:17 PM


Here is the link to the article you where refering to John McCain's personal account of him getting shot down. It is http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/2008... I would suggest everyone who is considering voting for him to read this. Very interesting.

-- Posted by gman on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:18 PM

KCPO, et al: In my Old Memory, which could well be faulty ... I seem to recall that yes, we were suffering casualties for some time before Kennedy's assassination in 1963, and that Johnson accelerated the 'war' during his presidency. Don't remember when we went there as "advisors," just that the French, as they were leaving, warned us that it was an un-winnable situation there.

-- Posted by gurusmom on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:20 PM


according to your weblink we did not have troops in Vietnam until 1965 before that they were advisors which was not combat forces. That goes along the same path as i had read earlier

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:22 PM


while I agree about the scooter I am not so sure a motorcycle would be the way to go either. I want something around me if some idiot tries to run me over.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:24 PM


Some call it flip flopping, I prefer to think of it as enlightenment or an epiphany. Fortunately I am not running for office or I would be in big trouble.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:25 PM

Thanks to all who supported this lowly teacher's statement(WOW - by Instructor's comment, I guess I'm supposed to know everything about everything - all the time). J/K

According to Anderson, "Eisenhower charted the course that President Lyndon Johnson followed to the fateful decisions of 1964 and 1965 to drop the bombs and land the Marines." Eisenhower "oversimplified and overcommitted" because he was "more skilled in tactics than in strategy."

Also the site Instructor cited, supports US involvment under Eisenhower. As a matter of fact, it's one I use from time to time for my classes. Thanks for the reference reminder Instructor.

-- Posted by DickCheney on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:26 PM

McCain was not so disabled that he couldn't dump his loyal and faithful wife and grab onto the young, rich, Barbi doll-lookin, drug-addicted Cindy Hensley. She spoke fondly and coyly about how the married John chased her around the buffet table at a cocktail party in Hawaii on the night they met. What a sweet couple.

-- Posted by grisgris on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:27 PM


Good for you all riders should wear the gear although I know many who do not. Some wouldn't even wear a helmet if not made to do so.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:30 PM


Aaaah there's the rub. Vietnam is now being called the Vietnam War, but in the past is was only a police action. Kind of falls under the what is "is"? And if the advisor's were not casualties of the War why are they on the War Wall??

Not really meaning to bust your balls, just seems there are conflicting stories even within the history of the War. Very interesting though.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:31 PM


Just meant I wasn't picking on you. Man you Conservative are so sensitive and touchy feely these days. LMAO j/k

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:38 PM

Pups: I'm still here. Its ok, I was just poking fun is all. Waiting till 5pm, my drug test should be in then I can start my new job, though I am getting paid sitting here.

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:38 PM


Cool. One of these days we'll have to have a mock debate only using extreme Right and extreme Left arguements. Well, ok maybe not on here, but one of the times you come visit.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:41 PM

My original statement was:

Also remember, the Dems inherited that war as I believe they will this one.

-- Posted by DickCheney on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, 3:20 pm CDT

Then came ...

"Dick, you are incorrect. Amazing considering you are in education."

-- Posted by Instructor_AKA___________ on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, 3:51 pm CDT

And now...

"Pups I still stand by my statement that the war was escalated by a Democrat president."

-- Posted by Instructor_AKA___________ on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, 4:25 pm CDT

I Was talking about the starting of the War/conflict, not the escalating. Escalating and starting are not the same thing.

-- Posted by DickCheney on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:44 PM


Wouldn't be the first time I was wrong. Hell it's not the first time I was wrong today.

Joking aside, agree with your statements about the Vietnam War.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:48 PM


It's all good. *went to fist bump ya, but the monitor got in the way*

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:51 PM

Pups: sounds great! I'm not sure when I'll be back for a visit but I will let you know.

I'm just excitied that Bush finally opened the water for drilling, on my way down here to Dads I saw many new drilling rigs going up. Aggie

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:52 PM


Sorry, not quite sure I follow.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:53 PM


Sorry, not quite sure I follow.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:53 PM

You and me both, Red: "Fortunately I am not running for office or I would be in big trouble." As I have grown and learned...I have changed many former opinions. Thinking it may be a matter of keeping a somewhat 'open mind,' and looking at more than one side of some issues?

Instructor: I rode a scooter once or twice (because Pops won one at a Kawasaki open house)--about scared me to death. Certainly felt more secure and safe on my Kawasaki 440--and would have gone to an even larger one if Pops hadn't put a stop to my riding! ~sigh~ You were correct the other day--those little helmets are just a token 'cap' to abide by the helmet laws. Although I didn't ride in "full gear" like you do, always used the best helmet available at the time.

Wasn't the 'Vietnam War' once called the 'Vietnam Conflict'? Did we really ever declare it a war?

Almost browsed over your post, Little_Mac. Glad I didn't.

-- Posted by gurusmom on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:55 PM

Dick, like I tell my students, I don't know everything BUT I can assure you if there is an answer, I'll find it.

No need to know everything, you just need the ability to research and find the answers.

-- Posted by Instructor_AKA___________ on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, 4:30 pm CDT

As a teacher, I do a lot of research and look at many sources for the facts I share with my students. I then try to give honest information to my students and let them know when the "facts" don't totally agree.

-- Posted by DickCheney on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 5:56 PM

Aggie (from yesterday): Your new job sound interesting and exciting! So glad that you are able to stay with your family down there, instead of being totally by yourself without your sweet lady. Wishing you both the best of everything, and hoping that you two stay in touch via the SO comments here. Know you'll both be so very missed by many up here.

-- Posted by gurusmom on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 6:00 PM


Not sure if most would call it fine form, but I'm in a good mood today. And the J/K are just to cover my butt. lol

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 6:20 PM

Well hi there, G-Maw:

I just got back and saw your question. So, to answer it, well, I've been around, but I think I got a mild case (besides my affliction with that RMS retirement thing, donchaknow?!) of the BBBs: Burnout, Boredom, and banality with the bog for awhile. Or maybe something tapped me on the shoulder - couldn't have been Mule...her "tap" equates to more of a pound! - and suggested my elongated summer days are rapidly wasting away, and perhaps I should invest more of that time doing something useful, or even useless if it's fun.

Anyway, I somewhat submitted to "the tap" and decided to spend my time doing other things, like working the plantation; that's like painting the Golden Gate Bridge with a handbrush...think you're done, but gotta start all over. Since M/W/F are my designated days to try to disappear in Cape's potholes and sinkholes, I figured T/Th can be partial bloviation days. Besides, my groupies have complained that too much time riding this 'puter like a cheap Yokosuka "professional" (settle down James) all day may cause my not-so-girlish-figure to bloat out like I can envision some of those all-day posters must be like. And my groupies are concerned that may negatively impact my overall "pretty" persona...they have to say nice things like that, lest they be served up on a plate in lieu of roadkill!! May be more tasty though.

So, I'm kinda-sorta studying if not practicing your more relaxed and occasional style a bit. Can't allow you to have a nicer figure than me, now, can I?! Speakin' of bloviating for recreation and non-profit, I guess I've blown my wad for one "T"-day.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 6:37 PM


Yes, I do think McCain treated his first wife shabbily. Even the Reagans were upset with him. The only public statement that Carol ever made was that he was "forty trying to act twenty-five again". But he and Cindy have been married for decades now.

Let's see our president's maritial history....

FDR died while with his mistress.

Truman was faithful to his vows.

Eisenhower was faithful to his vows.

Kennedy had multiple affairs.

Nixon was faithful to his vows.

Ford was faithful but married a divorced woman.

Reagan was faithful but divorced from his first wife.

Bush was faithful to his vows.

Clinton had multiple affairs.

Bush was faithful to his vows.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 6:53 PM

DWIGHT EISENHOWER: While fighting World War II in Europe, Eisenhower allegedly began an affair with his driver, Kay Summersby. The story goes that Ike planned to divorce his wife Mamie and marry Summersby; his superior, General George Marshall, quashed the plan by threatening to bust him out of the army. The rumor stayed mostly under wraps until 1975, when Summersby wrote a controversial book titled Past Forgetting: My Love Affair with Dwight D. Eisenhower.

-- Posted by DickCheney on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 7:01 PM

Glad you think Welker is so great, welcome to him

-- Posted by oldbluehair2008 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 7:16 PM


McCain's ex-wife was very kind to say only that John was "forty trying to act twenty-five again." She could just as easily have said that he was poor trying to be rich, married trying to act single, or horny trying to get some.

-- Posted by grisgris on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 7:33 PM

I read earlier today that, after weeks and weeks, someone is STILL griping about the avatars. JeeeZus H, man! Get Over It, Life's too **** Short as it is!

-- Posted by BoratObama on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 7:34 PM

Mr. Nall, that wasn't the WHOLE reason the US started Top Gun. Our ratio of kills dropped in Vietnam drastically bcause most of the jets we had relyed on our air to air. The F4 Phantom, which was the most popular jet of the war, didn't even have guns. The US decided it was safer to shoot at the enemy from 20 miles than from 200 ft. Wrong. N Vietnam did have very fine jets, that had a better turning radius than the F4.

Just like the war we are fighting now, we are fighting them on their turf. The congs could adapt to their surroundings. Just think if we had a war here on our turf.

JMO Aggie.

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 8:15 PM

Who Me,

Thanks for the information, having the full transcript helps, but even taken in the worse possible light, I would not make any decisions based on what he did all those years ago.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 8:24 PM


Go, go, go...

Too many folks think that a war can be won with air power, especially the young. But we will always need 'boots on the ground' to win.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 8:25 PM

Babe: not to be insulting to you, I am a FIRM believer in air power. Mr. Herr could explain this better thatn I can, but take the search for Osama in the caves. They know we a satellites in space so they move at night. Thy know we have bunker busters, so they dig deeper. Now I'm not saying nuke the whole nation but nuke where intell projects his whereabouts. Then play stupid. WE didn't do it!!

I just unloaded a can of worms now, huh? Aggie

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:00 PM

Who Me, it cost me almost $200 to drive down here to Texas.

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:02 PM

Darn, it's GREAT to 'see you,' Herr! Now..." ...like working the plantation; that's like painting the Golden Gate Bridge with a handbrush...think you're done, but gotta start all over" is something I absolutely understand, and can speak with authority about! It occurred to me several decades ago, why so many wives were so totally ready to jump onto the "you-can-have-it-all" Women's Lib bandwagon. Because no matter what they accomplished each day (cooking, dishes, vacuuming, bed-making, laundry, ironing--you know, you place a shirt on a long board & run a heavy hot metal device over it), the very next day it was all there to do again! Unfortunately, The Liberation part didn't work out quite as expected...Just added 40 more hours to their work week. Well, and probably some additional grumbling and discussing with the menfolk what THEIR role should be in all that Liberation? J/K, ladies! Pups is getting me into that covering my butt thing! ;-) Aw, shoot...maybe just sorta joking.

And okay...you're right...I've spread out somewhat over the past 20 years...but I attribute it to cream in my coffee! Although...come to think of it...it started when I went to work behind a desk...Hmmm, you might have something there after all.

-- Posted by gurusmom on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:10 PM

I know I posted this before AND I've been on the road, but hasn't anyone heard about the 500 tons of yellow cake Uranium that was shipped to Canada via Iraq? I not one to say "I told you so." But cr*p man, "I told you so."

Nice to see that no matter what this administration has done, the blinders are on, the wool is over the eyes, and people just don't give two sh*ts that the guys over there fought and died and believed when half of the public would rather extend the "Bush Lied" rants.

Ask a vet if they thought they did nothing. For starters there's a group coming back in a little while. Ask them.

Other than that, Gordanville needs two cops because they also assist Cape Co Sheriff's Dept. Big area.

-- Posted by fajar154 on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:21 PM

Thank you, BABE..."Let's see our president's marital history..." One of those sort of don't just pick and choose who one does or does not want to target for things that others have also done. You know what I mean?

James, I don't get tired of your posts. Don't always agree, but appreciate others' perspectives to think about.

Aggie, I hadn't really thought of that..."I'm not saying nuke the whole nation but nuke where intell projects his whereabouts." I don't know if it's realistic, but right now it seems to make some sense to me.

fajar "...people just don't give two sh*ts that the guys over there fought and died and believed...I do! But then, everyone who knows me knows my opinions on sending our men and women into kill-or-be-killed situtations unless it's for our country's protection. Perhaps that's the 'mother' in me.

-- Posted by gurusmom on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:33 PM

Dot or Period,

Exactly, it is your "opinion" and even if I accept everything as absolutely true, it makes no difference to me what so ever.

Being a sixty plus year old retired man does not make me able to judge and interpret the actions and motivations of all other sixty plus year old retired men.

Thank you for your service.

-- Posted by Red_Rhino on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:38 PM

Want an honest opinion of Barack Obama? Ask his bigot grandmother, whom he threw under the bus, along with his church, and Rev. Wright. Don't like the answer? Then there's nothing I can do for you.

-- Posted by BoratObama on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:46 PM

Do you judge everyone by what they did or didn't do forty or fifty years ago? How well would any of us fare?

-- Posted by Alt Ctrl Del on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 9:52 PM


You mean this one?


-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:10 PM

Hi again, G-Maw:

Taking a break from some rather boring TV tonight, so thought I'd check in again. Gotta admit, performing my "prisoner" (aka, bunny) rotation services ain't quite the drag it sometimes can be, 'cause Mule's still off doing that 10/7 gig for her heartless bosses...will probably go on the rest of the month, so I don't even get my usual quota of gripes and beatings right now...kinda miss 'em! I don't have to bottle-feed & wipe the babies anymore, but I have to rotate them and the adult prisoners to outdoor running pens and back inside again, seems like constantly. Being a bunny warden can be quite stressful, donchaknow?! Does that qualify as approved "whining"?!!

I think I can see your point about all that fake liberation nonsense offered by the NOW Naziettes. My Mule never needed those kinds of unlovely nut jobs to tell her she was liberated; all she has to do is pound me a little more for whatever freedoms she wants! Think I'd dare protest to her about that! Now, if she'd just "liberate" herself from that stupid job she has, like Aggie & Twiggs seem to have done, maybe we could have some more fun...if causing trouble can be considered more fun!! Speakin' of Aggie/Twiggs.


I haven't bloviated at ya in quite awhile. But according to your better half (gotta keep them NOW Naziettes off us!), you seem to be pretty happy about it. And by your own limited description of the job, sounds interesting; howsumever, I'll bet the global-cooling-warming-oops, er, climate-change commie enviro-wackos will hate ya even more now. For that, please accept my accolades, if not envy!! But just admit something here. I'll bet you two will miss at least a little about the ole truckin' days, won't ya? Good luck to you both in your new venture.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:18 PM

Tag-Herr, wie geht es Ihnen? I haven't actually started work yet. Waiting for the urine samples to show negative so I can get to making all that money.

Hope the mule doesn't weigh you down too much. I am looking forward to reuniting with Twiggy.

The trucking days will be missed but honestly the wear and tear was taking its toll. Good to hear from you. Aggie

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:39 PM


I swore that I would never debate this issue with you out of respect for your time served, but since you brought it up and I did a little (little being key here mind you) research, maybe you can answer some of my questions. I only ask for clarification not to be disrespectful to you or anyone else.

We knew the 550 tons were there and where it was in 1989 because it was reported on and sealed. We knew where it was in 1991. We knew where it was in 1998. We knew where it was in 2001. We knew where it was in 2003. (keeping in mind that it was sealed and accounted for the whole time.) Why did it take until 2008 to remove it and claim it to be found??

Also, found this quote from the link that Babe gave interesting,

"This was material that was discovered when we initially went in to Tuwaitha,” Whitman said. “It was under the control of the United Nations International Atomic Energy Agency since that time.”

Whitman stressed that yellowcake is not of direct use in a nuclear weapon. “It is a commodity that is traded routinely in the global nuclear energy sector,” he said. “It can be used as a feed material for nuclear weapons if a country has access to the necessary fuel technology.”

But my understanding is that Iraq did not have the necessary fuel technology. Or did they?

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 10:55 PM


I'm fine, and hope you are too. Your mention of my Mule weighing me down (wish she was here more often to do more of that!) reminded me of a bit more to say to you before I check out for the night. I think Twiggs (sorry, I like to call her that for some reason) should get a whole truck full of credit, and not to just keep us out of trouble either. But I simply think it's noble, and loving of her to be willing to leave her family here in MO for the chance for you to nail down a better job. I thought I'd only stay in MO about a year when I got here. Well, that was over twenty years ago. Mule has such a big family in MO, I just couldn't and wouldn't drag her away from them. But, to be fair, I was already retired, and didn't need to. Therefore, I hope the new job pays off big-time and in so many ways for both of you. Gute Nacht.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:15 PM

Pups I was thinking the same things. I even went to FOX to see if they had a different take/story, but couldn't even find the basic info. If it was a new big deal, I'm sure the Bush gang would have made it a big deal.

-- Posted by DickCheney on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:28 PM

Hey, Herr...In case you're still up and around...

Perhaps your Dictator Lady has been listening to too many horror stories from women whose menfolk have retired and are underfoot 24/7...and that's why she hangs onto the job? J/K

-- Posted by gurusmom on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:51 PM


Don't even dream that you will have access to high security and classified information until it is time for you to know it, my friend. Just try to understand that there are forces at work to keep you and me safe. It's an ugly world with people that would like to destroy every man, woman and child in the USA.

-- Posted by BABE on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 11:56 PM


-- Posted by DickCheney on Wed, Jul 16, 2008, at 12:05 AM

Hey, G-Mom:

THAT'S NOT FAIR!!! But, er, you may have a valid point there too, come to think of it! Even though I'm billed as a lovable and highly petable little HERRball, I suppose I could be a little testy for Mule to put up with. But at least she could find a more people-friendly job to hide out at! And, yeah, I'm still up & around, as I try to stay up for her, even though it's sometimes 1:30 or 2:00 a.m. before she drags in. Don't know how long this 10-7 nonsense is going to last.

Anyway, to keep myself occupied tonight, I've been checking in once in awhile between TV shows, and am tempted to plug in one of them "kill folks & break things" video games...just for virtual meanness, donchaknow! And I've been a bit curious watching some of the obsessed attempts to discredit our presence in Iraq and, of course, thereby our C in C. I've been trying to think of a way to ask some of the yahoos to explain to me some of what I was exposed to while dealing with European/Middle Eastern operations, even back in the 1980's...without getting into real trouble with the Feds. Perhaps in a more mischeivous mood I may be able to come up with something, vague as it may be.

Geeze, just got done done dealing with a "prisoner" (bunny) breakout and mutiny attempt too!! Gotta get things under control before Oberleutnant Mule gets home! If not, there'll be a different kind of HERR-raising!!!

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Wed, Jul 16, 2008, at 12:22 AM


First thanks for calling me friend. Second, if I'm being told "told you so" I think my questions are valid. Wouldn't you think that when the whole "Bush Lied" started that the Administration would have said, "No we didn't. Here is 550 tons to prove it"? From what I have seen from different articles on it, the yellowcake found was what we knew about back in 1991 or earlier and it was still sealed. Meaning not being used. And it was under guard by us or at the least 'friends' since 1991 if I am understanding the reports correctly.


Don't think of myself as trying to discredit the C and C or our presense in Iraq. Just asking questions. How else is a person to form informed ideas, thoughts, and understanding if they don't? And hopefully I have worded my questions so that it is understood that I am willing to hear apposing views on it. And I understand that you might not have directed your comment my way, just felt I needed to clarify my reasons for the questions.

-- Posted by Pups on Wed, Jul 16, 2008, at 1:05 AM


Forgot to remind you. I've lived in that region of the planet, granted some years ago, but I do have an understanding that some may not. Or at the very least a different perspective.

-- Posted by Pups on Wed, Jul 16, 2008, at 1:12 AM


I didn't really intend for you to think you were the target of my mild outrage earlier, regarding attempts to discredit our presence in Iraq or even our C&C. Nevertheless, you have to admit that has been the game plan of the extremist left from the git-go of this WOT. At least your musings are rather respectful, if not even thought-provoking; however, I must also agree even with what Babe had to say to you (no, no. That wasn't a gagging sound on my part!). There are simply some issues that neither you, me, or anyone else especially in this bog have a "need to know" about. Period.

Like I told G-Mom, perhaps I can think of a somewhat nebulous way to better clarify the above thoughts in the near future. But suffice it for now to understand that the Israelis are not the only ones capable of maintaining the ability of striking out of nowhere, let alone being identified. And that capability has existed for quite some time and, I dare say, not just intended for the old Soviet Union either. But, like I say, perhaps I can find a better way to explain it without getting into some kind of trouble...tonight is not the time, however. 'Night.

-- Posted by Herr_Hauptmann_DES on Wed, Jul 16, 2008, at 1:31 AM


Well, thanks for not 'gagging' when you agree with me. I respect your opinions and comments. Actually, I am highly offended by your comment.

-- Posted by BABE on Wed, Jul 16, 2008, at 1:57 AM


Thank you. I do sometimes try to get two brain cells to fire at the same time. lol I do understand the concept of "need to know" and the need for it. But sometimes you don't know you don't need to know until you know you aren't to know. You know??

Signing off for the night. Hope the bunnies let you rest and the 'mule' doesn't. lol

-- Posted by Pups on Wed, Jul 16, 2008, at 2:06 AM

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