[SeMissourian.com] Overcast ~ 61°F  
River stage: 16.49 ft. Falling
Sunday, Oct. 4, 2015

Speak Out 3/3/08

Monday, March 3, 2008

Twisted politics

OUR POLITICAL leaders should understand all the concerns with alternative fuels like ethanol. Just read the national headlines. The outlook is not as rosy as the well-dressed wolf in sheep's clothing has stated. Fire departments are not equipped to handle ethanol fires that require special foam. This should be a concern for our area if we get ethanol plants. Tell the politicians in this state to get it right before they mandate a hazardous situation in our backyard.

Banks are benefiting

I RECENTLY heard about another cut in the Federal Reserve interest rate. The problem is banks do not pass it on. The only thing that gets cut is the interest on your money-market account or your CDs. I've seen the rate on home loans go up after the Fed cuts as banks try to recoup their losses from foreclosures and bankruptcies. The only ones I see benefiting from Fed rate cuts are banks, not the consumers.

Time to sell the truck

GASOLINE PRICES are going through the roof because of increasing worldwide demand. It has nothing to do with supply, as a Speak Out caller suggested. The caller would be well-served to (as he mentioned he might) sell his truck.

Told you

WHAT DO people think about the NAFTA agreement now? And who remembers Ross Perot?

Thanks to volunteers

I WOULD like to praise the Southern Baptist Chainsaw Ministry for its service to our area. Special thanks go to volunteer Don Dickerson from the First Baptist Church of Millersville. Don is retired from Procter & Gamble, but he hasn't retired from helping people. Thanks also to the Southeast Missourian for putting the needed information online and on the front page. My yard is ready for city pickup.

Late-night power

I'M CALLING to thank the three men from AmerenUE who restored power on Hudson Drive on Tuesday a little before 2 o'clock in the morning. I got home from a late shift at the hospital and was tired and hungry. The power was out. I saw their trucks. I really appreciated them restoring the power just in time.

No equal justice

A PERSON would have to have an IQ lower than his shoe size to believe that if a black man from south Cape Girardeau had been charged with and found guilty of the same things as Dr. Reno Cova, he would have received equal justice from our judicial system.

Satellite tomfoolery

LAST WEEK, it was reported that spying by China has reached Cold War proportions. This week it was announced that we are going to share our technology on shooting down the defunct satellite with China. There used to be a name for this action. It was called treason.

Comment resented

I RESENT what Missouri House Speaker Rod Jetton had to say about Americans who are not fully employed. If he feels that strongly about the Mexican work ethic, then let them get licenses so they can drive to and from work. Mexicans watch over their brothers and sisters more than most Americans.

Community freezer

THIS IS a note to praise Schnucks Supermarket again for opening its freezers to all of us who were without power last week. It's a wonderful community service, way beyond the call of duty, that they would open the freezers so many of us would not lose our meat, even though we didn't get it from Schnucks. Again, praise and thanks to Schnucks.

Emotional story

I TRY not to be too emotional, but I couldn't help but be brought to tears after reading the story "Winning for Sahara" in the Sunday Missourian by Lindy Bavolek. Ms. Bavolek did a great job in writing that story, not only talking about the final basketball game of the season that Shannon Aldridge coached, but also about the life of Sahara Aldridge. I want to thank her for that. Good job.

We'll do it our way

I'D LIKE to point out to FEMA and Washington all the bad weather we've had here in the Midwest and the fact that FEMA has not been asked to get involved. Instead, neighbors are helping neighbors, and local governments are helping too. Everyone is helping everyone, and all the debris is being picked up and all the electricity is back on. We did what they couldn't. That's what it's about. Get rid of FEMA. Let us do it our way.

Agree with comment

SPEAKER ROD Jetton, I wholeheartedly agree with your comment regarding lazy Americans not working for money and relying on Uncle Sam to mail pesos to them. Legal aliens should be commended.

High school refund

COULD SOMEONE in the Missouri State High School Athletics Association explain why, in every district except District 1 in Class 4A, you pay to see the boys and girls championship game? District 1 makes it two different sessions. The Notre Dame-Sikeston boys game is a sellout so it should only cost $2 instead of $4 as it's only one game. Notre Dame may have two teams in it, boys and girls, so would the cost for each student or parent be $8 per person? It's the only district in Southeast Missouri that does it. Every person who goes through the gate Saturday should be given a $2 refund.

Working, and voting

SHAME ON you, Rod Jetton, for calling Southeast Missourians lazy. We're not all on welfare. Some of us do work. You know, some of us vote. We're a little sensitive about being called lazy when we go to work everyday.

Sensor lights

FOR THE love of God, Cape Girardeau, please get sensor stoplights. When I'm the only car at an intersection, there's no reason why I should have to sit there for five minutes.

Leaves on street

THE CITY needs to get the leaves on Abby Road near Lexington Road. They've been there three or four months. I don't care about the branches that are blocking my street and the tree that's down in front, but I want those leaves moved.

Helpful driver

I WANT to thank the guy who was driving the AmeriMart truck. My 5-month-old and I were trying to get out of my driveway, and I got stuck. The AmeriMart driver pulled me out. It was so nice of him. I live in Fruitland off U.S. 61. Thank you.

Appalling column

I WAS appalled when I read Sunday's column "He's got your nose, honey" and found mother-to-be Callie Clark Miller referring to her unborn son as an adorable, pig-snout mutant with a great future in the circus. I would have expected a woman who has endured multiple miscarriages to choose her words more carefully. Did she take into consideration the parents reading her article who have children with life-threatening birth defects? She should feel blessed to still be carrying a healthy baby and have a little more tact in writing future columns.

No to deer hunting

WE TAKE the deer habitat away and complain when the deer cause vehicle accidents or eat soybeans. An elderly woman backed into my car because she thought she was out in the intersection too far. What happens to her because she caused an accident? Most deer hunters drink alcohol while hunting. I don't want them hunting in my backyard. This is one thing I say no to.

He's worth it

I GUESS what would be important about James Carville and his wife coming here and the $64,000 it cost is how many seats were filled and was it a successful night for the Show Me Center. I have better things to do on a winter night, and $64,000 seems like a lot of money. Would Michael Moore, the movie producer, come for $64,000? At least, he'd be entertaining.

Good comments

IT'S AMAZING that some of you have to tear down somebody else's hard work with insults and negative comments. The Cape Girardeau County Highway Department has done tremendous work. For somebody to say road crews pushed branches into a creek is plain false. Let's be positive and comment about good things, not tear people down.

Columnist is wrong

COLUMNIST KATHERINE Lopez says Barack Obama is naive on foreign policy. I like that Obama is willing to meet with any foreign leader. But if Lopez wants our leaders to continue a policy of careless bombing and perpetual warfare, she's free to do so even though history has proved this ineffective. She calls Obama a radical on abortion. The majority of us realize that abortion needs to be safe and legal. She also says Obama would pull troops out of Iraq immediately, which is blatantly false. Obama's plan would send 90,000 troops to the region.

Proving a point

IT IS interesting to note that David Limbaugh says, "Conservatives believe that government is a necessary evil." I would agree that the Bush and Blunt administrations are doing their best to prove that they are indeed necessary and evil.

To much suffering

I AM from a family of hunters and am not opposed to hunting. I am, however, opposed to any hunting in the city limits. I strongly oppose hunting game with bows and arrows. Hunting with bows and arrow inflicts too much unnecessary pain and suffering on the animals that are hunted.

Leave deer alone

Leave those deer alone. We build in their territory. People are greedy today. The Bible says the love of money is the root of all evil. Greedy people shouldn't be moving where the deer are, because they are running them into town. If you don't want to live around them, don't build around them.

Truth hurts

WHY DAVID Limbaugh's column irritates some is such a joke. Why take it so seriously? Don't read it. If you're a liberal Democrat, you're going to disagree with any conservative view. Keep up the good work, David. Make the liberals squirm and curse. The truth hurts.

Helpful neighbors

I WANT to thank all those involved in catching the two horses that were loose on Route Y Monday morning. I want to thank the couple who knocked on the door, the highway patrol who responded so quickly, Lennie down the road for his time and effort and the couple who led them back to the barn. None of these people own these horses. They were being good neighbors. God bless all of them. Thank you.

Thanks, Red Cross

THANK YOU to the Red Cross for the help it provided to those who were sheltered at Immaculate Conception Catholic Church during the ice storm. The Red Cross folks did a fantastic job. They brought cots, blankets and food. A crew cooked for us. We thank them for their kindness and for all the effort they put forth to making us comfortable. Thank you so much. May God bless you.

Pickup plan

Thanks to Cape Girardeau for its decision to hire help to pick up all the piles of tree limbs around the city following the ice storms. Even though the city is paying extra for the pickup crews, it will save money in the long run. City crews will be free to tend to the many other needs and the limbs will be disposed of quickly. Perhaps this will help to improve the mood of the city, which has been affected by the aftermath of these terrible storms. Thank you.

Fact Check
See inaccurate information in this story?

Note: The nature of the Internet makes it impractical for our staff to review every comment. If you feel that a comment is offensive, please Login or Create an account first, and then you will be able to flag a comment as objectionable. Please also note that those who post comments on semissourian.com may do so using a screen name, which may or may not reflect a website user's actual name. Readers should be careful not to assign comments to real people who may have names similar to screen names. Refrain from obscenity in your comments, and to keep discussions civil, don't say anything in a way your grandmother would be ashamed to read.

Most hunters do NOT drink while they are hunting. Only a few, irresponsible ones, do.

-- Posted by bobby62914 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 1:10 AM

The power to tax involves the power to destroy. Justice John Marshall

The average US Representative supported 5 cents in spending reductions for every dollar in spending increases. The average US Senator voted for 4 cents in spending reductions for every dollar in spending increases. So...

Tax Freedom Day this year is April 30. That is four months (one-third of a year) to support government. See, I do know a little math! ;-) However, Daylight Savings Time starts on March 9. It is good to know that we can save time, if not money.

-- Posted by gurusmom on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 1:49 AM

Sportsmen hunters are some of the most responsible and safety minded individuals in the nation. Saying most of them drink beer while hunting is an out right lie. The bow hunting in city limits would be confined to the areas that are wooded and remote and on a very limited by special permit basis. Find a real problem to worry about!

-- Posted by Data48 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 6:44 AM

Babe, Didn't you have a deer issue a few months back? What is your opinion on the bow hunting proposal?

James, Hope you wet tootsies are dry by now!

Lazy comments: Great example of how the media plays a role in the public's perception. Ugh!

AmerenUE, I am so sorry, think I am the only one who hasn't had a chance to submit a comment thanking you for doing the job you are pay well for every month!

-- Posted by coke zero on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 8:02 AM

Deer have a very sensitive sence of smell. Most successful hunters know this.

Alcohol has a strong scent and, as anyone with hunting knowledge knows, would alarm the deer to stay away.

I have known many hunters and know that the most serious of them would wait until time to quit hunting to drink or smoke. Then, yes, they usually drink to excess; but, not until their firearms or bows are locked and put away.

Only the complete idiot, which I am sure there are some, would do otherwise.

-- Posted by Nanno on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 8:09 AM

McCain would be another George WWW Bush for another 4 years, Lord help this country. Nafta must be changed.

Ethanol is the 'pits', another way for the poor farmer and business men to rip off the consumers. I tried E-85----it dont work.

-- Posted by changedname on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 9:26 AM

We went down to Texas for Thanksgiving and I used E85 and truck ran fine, didn't loose power or fuel mileage. Differant opinions.

-- Posted by Aggiefan/Twiggy on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 9:42 AM


Do not judge all hunters because of a few that are careless. My father and brothers have went hunting with all of the men in the family for my entire life and in 37 years there has never been any drinking or carelessness. I allowed them to take my son on the youth hunt this last year and if they were all so careless I wouldn't have dreamed of it. My parents also live in a very wooded area and I have seen all to well the havoc they can cause in a carefully maintained yard and I blame no one for wanting them gone besides nothing like a nice deer roast or bowl of deer stew.

The comment the Millers made about their baby was probably made not thinking it would offend anyone. I made the comment from an ultrasound my son looked like an ape, it didn't mean I was serious it was a joke. After several miscarriages she is probably dealing with humor to keep from stressing over loosing another one.

-- Posted by semoangel70 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:04 AM

My wife and I deer hunt on public lands along with our sons and their families. Many other hunters also utilize that area. We often visit the other camp sites and others come by ours. While we don't know all of the other hunters, we have come into contact with many of them. No one in my family drinks and on no occasion have we seen any evidence of excessive use of alcohol by other hunters in that area. I am not saying that no deer hunters act irresponsibly, but to say that "most" deer hunters "drink" or that most "drink to excess" is just irresponsible and untrue. I have found the hunters with whom I have come into contact to be very responsible and safety conscious.

As to bowhunting in Cape, I believe it can be done safely if confined to certain areas as there are sections within the city limits that are wooded and isolated enough, but have no strong feelings one way or the other and don't live in Cape.

-- Posted by D'oh on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:13 AM

We'll do it our way,

The fact is we had two ice storms only one of whcih cause any significant damage (hope we don't have another tonight). We went without electricity and had to cut and gather some tree limbs. I understand there wer homes damaged and what not as well.

This was not someithing for FEMA. We should help each other. These kind of things happen all over the world everyday.

I say "Bring on the Deer Hunters"


Regarding NAFTA in theory it would be nice to remove government intervention in trade. In fact NAFTA is opening up some of the markets. The US is taking the lead in free trade despite other countries not following suit. As the leader of the free world we are taking our lumps with it but it will prove out to be the right move in the long run.

-- Posted by SWBG on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:21 AM

I have seen county employees dump brush in the creek twice. once after the ice and once when they cut up a tree and dumped it in the down stream side so don't say it isn't so if you don't know the facts. Obviously I am not the only one who has seen it.

-- Posted by monitoringthepulseofcapecounty on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:44 AM

I, too, found the Miller's column about their baby to be rather tasteless.

-- Posted by conservababe on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:49 AM


The hunters can come on my two wooded lots anyday. I have a pest doe visiting my yard daily and scares my grandchildren because she tries to get closer to them. And no, they would not be squeamish about seeing it killed as they are not of the "bambi" mindset as some of our posters.

-- Posted by conservababe on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:56 AM

RE: Late-night power

Pretty cool, isn't it? We had some utility relocates get behind because all of the crews were busy restoring power due to the ice and it doesn't bother me one bit. We have to fix what's broken before we can improve anything.

RE: Community freezer

This caller kind of has it right. Schnucks opening up it's freezers is just another form of advertising and getting customers into the store. It's a straight pain in the *** for all of the workers.

RE: Sensor lights

I agree but I think that Cape has started to tweak their (not MoDOT's) signals because they are actually working quite well for the most part. Trust me, signals with actuated cameras are a whole let better than signals that are still on timers.

RE: Deer hunting

I'm an avid hunter and I oppose hunting deer via any means within the city limits. There are at least some citizens who like to watch the deer around their property--I know that the people in my mom's neighborhood do. Of course, I don't drink while hunting--you're supposed to fall asleep in the words naturally :P.

RE: Pickup plan

I was fortunate to be at my mom's house this past Saturday when a crew came to pickup limbs. For those of you who haven't seen them yet, a city worker directs traffic while a driver/operator uses a boom/claw to pick up limbs while a laborer organizes the pile on the ground. When I watched them, they were very efficient--I hope the city gets reimbursed, but, if they don't, it's still money well spent.

-- Posted by ynot on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:32 AM

I am a very avid hunter who lives in Northern Cape county. I've hunted all kinds of animals from turkeys and deer, to squirrels and raccoons, to rabbits and coyotes, and even enjoy frog gigging and fishing. I have NEVER drank while handling any of the weapons we use to hunt with, whether it be a rifle, shotgun, bow, or gig. That's just common sense people. The one's that DO drink while they're hunting not only give the rest of us RESPONSIBLE hunters a bad name but they are not true hunters. A true hunter spends time in the woods getting to know the animal they're hunting. They learn their daily patterns; where they eat, drink, follow paths, and bed down. We use responsibilty and eithics when harvesting an animal. Even if I don't harvest an animal when I hunt, I'm just thankful that I can go out into the woods and see nature at it's finest.

And as for all the people concerned about hunting inside city limits; as I said, I don't live in Cape so it really doesn't concern me, but please don't bad mouth hunters if you've only known a few bad apples.

-- Posted by LulaBell on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:32 AM


You can hunt and enjoy wildlife both, that is what proper deer management is all about.

We live on over three hundred acres of woods and row crop land. We enjoy watching deer in our back yard where we have a feeder, but in spite of the fact that we prefer to hunt elsewhere, we still harvest deer from our own property occasionally to manage the herd.

I believe herd management, not elimination is the goal sought in Cape also.

-- Posted by D'oh on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:55 AM

No equal justice:

Your ignorance is showing. First and second time drug offenders routinely get probation. Get a clue.

-- Posted by Ike on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 12:18 PM

Conservababe. Poor taste? You have a lot of nerve saying that considering what I read of your actions last week.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 12:45 PM

Quit complaining about the deer in your yard Conservababe and pull out your vast arsenel of weapons you used while in the militia. Oh...that's right, that was all just a lie wasn't it.

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 12:47 PM

As far as this deer hunting thing goes. Let's get real, the real danger is the animal will not die where it is shot. It will head into someone's yard and die there. Like I said before, I will consider "armed" trespassers on my property a threat and will deal with them appropriately, "lethal force."

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 12:51 PM

Comment resented

Are those Mexican's still Mexicans? Or are they Americans? If they're here illegally then I don't give two poops about how well they treat their family.

Funny, you never hear about how well any other immigrant treats their family or how unfairly they are treated.

Oh, thats right, they come here legally. My bad. The victims are the ones who do things that are on the otherside of the law, but since it's for their betterment, fine and dandy.

So, I can knock off a couple banks to provide a better setting for my family?

No? Because I'm white.

-- Posted by fajar154 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 12:55 PM

Actually fajar Mexicans are Americans. So are Canadians. Anyone from this hemisphere is an American.

Canadians tend to recent us monopolizing the term "American". Europe refers to us as being "from the States". Just had to comment. I do not know what the rest of your post is about.

-- Posted by SWBG on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 1:06 PM


I'm still under the impression that America is a melting pot. To this day, I've never refered as myself as a German/Irish/and dash of Indian American. So why do people want to be treated as Americans when they wave their flag from the Homeland?

National Pride? Sure. But why did you come to this country in the first place? Because their country sucks. Plain and simple. If Mexico is sooooo great then why is everyone (legally???) jumping across the Rio Grande?

Bald Guy, do you call yourself by your European nationality? If so, remember why your ancestors came over here. Because it sucked!

Drop your precorsory nationalities; African American, Mexican American, French American, German American, Latin American and just stick to one where your banner can fly without fear.

-- Posted by fajar154 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 1:27 PM

Bald Guy,

When have you EVER heard a Canadian say that they were North American? They say they're Canadian, EH!

-- Posted by fajar154 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 1:29 PM

Another thing that people shouldn't forget when discussing what to do about the deer population inside Cape city limits, is that these deer are WILD ANIMALS. Yeah they're neat to watch and pretty to look at, but when it comes to protecting their young or especially during rut, they can become unpredictable. If I remember right, a few months back there was a man that was killed by a buck in rut and this animal was one that he'd kept as a "pet" along with some does. I know the possibility of a deer attacking a human are pretty slim, but the larger a deer population in town becomes the higher chances of them coming into contact with humans are. Just think about that when you and your kids are taking a walk in the park or a wooded area in town. Not to mention the hunting would help with disease and starvation. How else would people want to control the population of these deer? Other than coyotes or maybe an occasional mountain lion, (and I guess the front of your car) humans are the only way to control a growing deer population. Maybe we should relocate some mountain lions into the city limits! Then nobody would have to worry about the hunters. Yeah, a mountain lion perched on your back porch, that would make people think twice about badmouthing hunters!

-- Posted by LulaBell on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 1:59 PM


Bingo..you are a winner. Yes, deer can be dangerous as well as being pests. As Joe Sullivan described in his column, the deer were very tame when confronted by humans and this is not good. I have heard people in this city complain that the city did not pick up a raccoon in their yard which was little threat to them or their family. Yet they just loooove to watch the deer as they are so cute and not acknowleging they are dangerous.

-- Posted by conservababe on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 2:19 PM

Very very interesting...


-- Posted by conservababe on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 2:21 PM

James Nall

When YOUR ancestors came over there was no government and they could NOT rely on welfare, social security, free medical care and food stamps on the back of the taxpayers. LOL

-- Posted by conservababe on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 3:15 PM

James Nall,

My ancestors stepped off a ship in 1690.

Things were of course,much different then.

Frankly I do care about a few Mexicans and or any other person who comes into this Country.It was near a full century after my ancestors arrived that we even became a country.Now we have laws and we all have to contribute through taxation.These illegals are not contrbuting to anything but their pocketbooks and Families back in Mexico.Its

obvious to me you have not left the area much.You have not wittnesed the gang activities in N.Illinois and many other areas

in this Country!Mexican gangs!filled with many who do not have papers or names!Nope,I say get rid of everyone of them NOW!Perhaps you would feel a bit different if Marble Hill were infested with a bunch of Mexican hoods!They don't all have good work ethics James,believe me!

-- Posted by GREYWOLF on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 3:20 PM

James Nall

I hate to burst your bubble but gangs are moving into rural areas as fast as you can lock and load.


-- Posted by conservababe on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 3:44 PM


If you have never dealt with a gang member, you cannot fully appreciate how bad and dangerous they can be. About a year ago I spoke with one who had killed another individual because of the way the individual looked at him. He had no remorse and showed no feeling other than justification for his actions as the individual "should have known better." I taped my interview with him for others to listen to and gain some insight into their thinking. In another case a member of a Jamaican Gang lured a member of a Mexican gang to a location for the sole purpose of beating and killing him over a past drug deal. The few true gang members with which I have dealt fear no one, not even rednecks or hillbillies as death is nothing unique in their world. They may not scare you, but they sure scare me.

-- Posted by D'oh on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 4:43 PM


Actually that was not my point. I was responding to your post about them not being able to make it out in the sticks. One should never underestimate their danger or assume that because we live in the "sticks" we have nothing to fear from them. But since you mention it, no the "government police" have been unable to effectively deal with the gangs or organized crime. They never have been and I don't think they ever will. I don't think however that they should stop trying. I would hate to think how bad they could be.

-- Posted by D'oh on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 6:37 PM

Umm, yes, KJT, I am fully aware of managing wildlife... I thought that I implied that in my post earlier... I'm just saying that there are city folk who enjoy the animals. Granted, we can't interact with deer very well, but, if we start to hunt them, they will leave. I've stood less than 10 feet away from members of the deer family--I counted 8 this past summer--that live in the area surrounding my mom's neighborhood and, if we should start hunting deer in the city limits, that will never happen again. People just have to watch out when they drive around wooded areas...

-- Posted by ynot on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 6:55 PM


Why not give us your Mom's view since it is her home and neighborhood?

-- Posted by conservababe on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 7:14 PM

Appalling column---

I don't think you are correct to be so quick to judge. Many people deal with losses and even extreme trials in different ways. If you don't feel like the article was appropriate--skip the column in the future. As someone pregnant right now--I found her column lighthearted and funny. I have shared with with the group of women I am closest to on BabyCenter--a group of about 45 women--many of whom have had miscarriages, disable children, or have multiple children and none of them felt offended. If you are too sensitive to the topic at this time...you should refrain instead of pressing your negativity onto someone else's blessing.

I know I myself have had dreams and worries about pregnancy being like the movie from alien. I even had an ultrasound tech who mentioned my baby had "an alien face." Trust me, thick skin can go a long way in life.

-- Posted by SuperBethie21 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 7:19 PM

Deer during rutting season can be aggressive--even towards humans.

Many large cities have had issues with deer in city limits.

I also remember SIUC having issues of aggressive deer in the wooded path areas in the middle of campus in the last few years.

-- Posted by SuperBethie21 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 7:21 PM


I think alot of expectant mothers have had that dream since the Alien movie was released.

Though I will admit that I actually broke out laughing at that sceen when I saw it. My brother and I had snuck in to the theater. It was when I lived overseas and the late movie was usually for the adults and we were 13. Got us busted and thrown out. LOL The rest of the movie was good, but still laugh when I see that movie. (Movie trivia, did you know that Veronica Cartwright's reaction was real as she wasn't told that the special effects team had rigged the splatter to hit her in the face?)

-- Posted by Pups on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 7:50 PM

I don't know wether bow hunting dear with in the city limits is good or bad. Though an injured deer is just as dangerous as one in the throws of mateing. (Just wondering, can I take out my neighbor? He is kind of skittish and easily spooked like a dear. And I wouldn't want him around Babe's grandkids either. LMAO)

-- Posted by Pups on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 7:56 PM

Movie Quote game continues......

"Fat lady? You're obsessed with the Fat Lady."

-- Posted by Pups on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 8:03 PM

LOL...when he moves really hard and I can literally see my belly moving..

I still worry just a little about "Alien."

LOL..totally irrational pregancy fear. =)

-- Posted by SuperBethie21 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 8:17 PM

Mary, you need to familiarize yourself with the use of lethal force. Shooting a bow hunter on your property will get you a murder charge guaranteed.

On second thought, go for it. If you are in jail for life, you wouldn't be able to post.

Just kidding (kinda)

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 8:29 PM


Let's see. Fleeing felon, unarmed, shot in back.


Unknown assailant, on my property, weapon in hand, shot in chest. Hmmm

Which one sounds more believeable? Sure would be nice if you were the one with the bow and arrow on my property. j/k (kinda)

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 8:43 PM


When I was younger and my sister was pregnant, I used to love watching the head roll, or the hand/foot print on her belly. Kind of weird, but sooo cool to see.

-- Posted by Pups on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 8:46 PM

LOL..I can't wait till it gets more defined..now I can just see movement..

areas where there will be a wave of moment..or spots where I can see tapping.

I do think it is cool...it just really provokes my irrational fear. LOL

He's sa big dancer though...so I get a lot of movement...he's hardly ever still for long.

-- Posted by SuperBethie21 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 8:55 PM

If I am not mistaken, isn't said individual who allegedly shot fleeing felon in the back being charged with felony involuntary manslaughter?

Now back to your issue with shooting a bow hunter on your property. Please see the following link and educate yourself.


In conclusion, there isn't a prosecutor in Missouri that wouldn't charge you with MURDER if you shot a hunter on your property (provided said individual wasn't physically threatening you).

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 9:00 PM


A shot of Crown might calm bebe down a bit. LMAO just kidding. Just imagine, this active now, waite till he's 2 and running around the house. Sure you don't want to rethink the daycare?? LOL (Sorry, been a really long day.)

-- Posted by Pups on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 9:01 PM

Nice threat Mary. Thanks for implying you wish it were me you were shooting.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 9:02 PM

LOL Pups.

One of the few things I've been dying for is a nice shot of whiskey. I won't get one till June if I'm lucky.

Hrm...does make one wonder about the upsides of daycare. *winkz*

-- Posted by SuperBethie21 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 9:27 PM


Well I will gladly buy you your first shot when you are able. Have a great night.

-- Posted by Pups on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 9:40 PM

I have to say mary, your debating skills are on par with a twelve year old child.

Have a good evening.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 9:42 PM


I'll hold you to it, Pups...

Have a good night and a safe night at work!!! =)

-- Posted by SuperBethie21 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 9:53 PM

yes, one has to stupe to that level when debating with you Hellomynameis. After all, who started with the niceties first?

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:11 PM


You're good at the MJB cut and paste tactics, but do you actually "READ" and comprehend what you post?

"he or she reasonably **not the word reasonably** believes such force to be necessary to defend himself or herself or a third person from what he or she reasonably believes to be the use or imminent use of unlawful force by such other person"


"Such force is used against a person who unlawfully enters, remains after unlawfully entering, or attempts to unlawfully enter a dwelling, residence, or vehicle lawfully occupied by such person"

Let's see here is the scenerio: A single mother of two, unknown assailant on her property, brandishing a lethal weapon.

Do you really want to chance "reasonable" belief? Did you graduate high school? Or did you get a GED?

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:20 PM


are you inferring something negative about those who have a GED? o.O

I don't but know a lot of intelligent people who do.

You should probably just keep your snarkiness to yourself....

it's offensive whether you realize it or not.

-- Posted by SuperBethie21 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:27 PM


Actually, she is right. It's all about interpretation of law and wording. "Reasonably" is there specifically for the purpose she states.

The difference with her scenario and Steven Julian is: Snyder was running away, shot in the back, and unarmed. Additionally, in the Julian case we are not dealing with breach of a personal dwelling or property.

In the future, if one is going to cite the law, one should understand it.

I'd take her case.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:27 PM

Brandishing a hunting bow? Sorry mary, the fact of the matter is, you shoot an individual on your property who is presenting no threat whatsoever and is not attempting to gain access to your residence, you are going to be charged with murder.

The quotes only back up what I have stated all along.

Like I said, you are debating like a twelve year old.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:27 PM

Did I yank your chain?

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:29 PM

I actually just thought the statement related to ged's/diplomas displayed such ignorance that anything else you were arguing was completely overshadowed.

-- Posted by SuperBethie21 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:30 PM

Mary, I have been a concealed carry permit holder for several years and carry a 9mm handgun **** near 24/7. I am very versed in the use of lethal force.

Your scenarios hold no credence. You would be charged with murder.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:32 PM


You are certainly wrong. I'd take that bet anyday for as much as you want to lose. *If* the perpetrator has come on her property armed and unsolicited, she has every right to defend her property.

Is the hunter going to have a big sign on his head saying, "Deer Hunter?" No!

He will be in camo. A bow and arrow are a lethal weapon. If they will kill a deer, they can kill a human. Does she chance that the *unknown* assailant brandishing a lethal weapon is there for tea and cookies? Or does she defend her children from a "reasonable" threat?

I don't think you get how the law works do you? I suggest you ask someone who deals in law every day, insteading of playing prosecuting attorney on here.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:35 PM

Hellomynameis if you were to enter a property *unsolicited* with your 9mm drawn, what do you think the consequences would be?

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:37 PM

At most she would get manslaughter, but most probable she would be acquitted.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:41 PM

shiva, I would suggest you take a concealed carry class. You would find out just how wrong you are.

Perhaps calling the prosecuting attorney's office and presenting the scenario (hunter who is not physically threatening, not trying to gain access to the residence) might change your mind?

You have to read the entire statute to understand it.

PS I am going to speculate that neither you nor mary have taken the CCW classes.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:41 PM

If you and mary think you are so correct, go ahead and follow through.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:45 PM

Hellomynameis, I do conceal and carry already and am quite versed in law. We have variables here. Trespass with a "perceived" intent to harm, and the use of lethal force against a "perceived" threat.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:51 PM

Actually mary, I never got past my sophomore year of high school. Shortly after that, my 15 year old girlfriend became pregnant. We got married and divorced but not before she had one other child.

She now is a single mother with custody of those two children and shoots innocent hunters for no reason whatsoever.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:53 PM

If they're trespassing, they're not that innoscent.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:54 PM

Like I said shiva, it is your life. If you think you are so **** correct, shoot the next person who steps foot on your property.

I'll read about it in the newspaper.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:55 PM

You conceal and carry? Oh really?

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:56 PM

Hellomynameis. You're wrong again (as usual.) After I was stalked by a psycho, I got my conceal and carry.

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:57 PM

Yes, many in my profession conceal and carry ;o)

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:58 PM

I'm from Texas originally.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 10:59 PM

Well, I am happy to hear you have your CCW permit. I obviously need to retract my comment and apologize for making an incorrect assumption.

Sorry to hear about you being stalked. I hope the proper law enforcement officials caught the person.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:00 PM

Most of the folks in my part-time profession carry weapons openly and use them often.

Glad to hear you have your CCW permit also shiva.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:02 PM


Let's allow you to put your foot in your mouth a bit further. *Since you know it all*

Since the law states,

"he or she reasonably believes such force to be necessary to defend himself or herself or a third person from what he or she reasonably believes to be the use or imminent use of unlawful force by such other person"

Would you care to define "reasonably" here for us?

Additionally, you *do not* have to retreat when you are on your own property.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:04 PM

Like I said folks, I concede. You are correct with shooting an innocent hunter on your property who is not trying to gain access to your residence or physically threatening you.

Kill 'em all.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:06 PM

Also, are you going to allow an *armed* unknown assailant to make it to the door of your house? Or are you going to nail him before he gets closer to your family?

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:08 PM

Yes shiva, the next person who approaches my door, I shall shoot and kill prior to reaching said residence.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:09 PM

I mean a good scenario for this would be:

5:30A.M. Mary Jo is awakened by something outside. She sees an unknown man with a bow and arrow in her yard, no one else is around.

She has been previously stalked, and thinks this may be the same person, but it's early and she couldn't tell for sure. She sees the man raise the bow and arrow. What does she do?

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:12 PM

I have already conceded that she should shoot and kill the criminal.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:13 PM

Gee thanks, I'm creeped out now. I'll be looking out the windows all night. That would "totally" freak me out at 5:30AM with some guy in my yard with bows and arrows.

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:15 PM

Sorry, just trying to put things in perspective.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:17 PM

Hellomynameis. That's just it, we are talking about a "perceived" threat.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:18 PM

Wow! It's slow in here tonight! Everyone must be running to the store for milk and bread. LOL

-- Posted by Proud_Democrat on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:23 PM

Shiva_God_of_Death and mary jo.

Before you shoot a hunter you need to talk to the prosecutor's office. If you did go the the C and C class you would know you are wrong about many of your statements. Both of you are gun haters as you have stated in the past. Now go watch Bambi again.

I had a lake house in a neighborhood where the owners started feeding the deer. It was all fine and cute for a couple of years until there were hundreds of them coming in at night and eating the landscapes, flowers, and destroying ornamental trees.

Finally everyone got together and agreed not to attract them and try their best to run them out. We asked locals to come and hunt them during season and gave them keys to the gates to get in. I haven't thought of a deer being cute ever since. It took about three years to get rid of them. Your area might be next.

-- Posted by Who Me? on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:24 PM


Don't know if this answered "Independence Day!"

-- Posted by fajar154 on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:26 PM

Who me. Is the word clueless often associated with your photo? When have I *ever* said anything about hating guns?? Oh please show me that quote, I would be very interested in seeing that one.

We not talking about hating guns. I think the real issue at hand here is property rights and folks walking all over your property with lethal weapons.

I have nothing against guns or bows and arrows for that matter, but I just don't want every Tom, Dick, and Harry up on my property playing Elmer Fudd.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:30 PM


I would hate to be your mailman. :)

-- Posted by Who Me? on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:31 PM

HAHA, Who_me, you are crazy! I have NEVER said I was a gun hater. Are you on drugs? or do you just like talking out your a$$? That is probably one of "the" most stupid comments I have seen on this forum.

Yes, please...show me mine also. I am very interested in reading it.

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:33 PM

Let's see, I own a dyna super glide and a 40 cal beretta mini-cougar, but Who_me makes an obscure statement saying I'm a gun hater. What a nutball.

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:41 PM

*sigh* I sold my heritage softail when I left Peoria. Dang! I wished I still had that thing.

-- Posted by Proud_Democrat on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:44 PM

A classic? Really...what year?

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:47 PM

It was a 1997. Yikes, you're scaring me mary_jo! I used to own a 40cal. beretta mini-cougar myself. I still have my 40cal.Centurion. That thing has "NEVER" jammed on me. It's smooth as silk. Those berettas are A number 1 guns.

I used to own an old Smith and Wesson 357 model 19. Once I got those berettas in my hand I said, "Adios" to the revolvers.

-- Posted by Proud_Democrat on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:52 PM

Ohhh those true hogs. That's too cool! Yes, I love my mini-cougar, I had some problems with it jamming when I first bought it, but once I ran some rounds through it, it smoothed out. It's nice and compact, but still very heavy.

-- Posted by Snoops_Malone on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:56 PM

I purchased my mini-cougar new. Infact I think I purchased mine when they just came out with them. It had the same problem, but after some use it was just as good as the centurion.

-- Posted by Proud_Democrat on Mon, Mar 3, 2008, at 11:58 PM


You are correct. Not many get that quote, but it's from one of my favorite scenes of that movie.

-- Posted by Pups on Tue, Mar 4, 2008, at 12:15 AM


I'm a little late...but trespassing laws are not necessarily in favor of the property owner.

For example, here is the City of Cape's information...

Sec. 17-50. Trespass in the first degree.

(a) A person commits the offense of trespass in the first degree if he knowingly enters unlawfully or knowingly remains unlawfully in a building or inhabitable structure or upon real property.

(b) A person does not commit the offense of trespass in the first degree by entering or remaining upon real property unless the real property is fenced or otherwise enclosed in a manner designated to exclude intruders or as to which notice against trespass is given by:

(1) Actual communication to the actor; or

(2) Posting in a manner reasonably likely to come to the attention of intruders


-- Posted by coke zero on Tue, Mar 4, 2008, at 2:40 AM

You folks don't understand, shiva and mary both have the right to shoot and kill someone who is committing misdemeanor trespass on their property.

I have never heard anyone who has a CCW permit refer to it as "conceal and carry" (as quoted by both shiva and mary).

For you folks who love your guns, watch out because the winds of change (obama) don't particularly care for you Second Amendment rights. In addition, hillary would love to reinstate the "assault weapons" ban.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Tue, Mar 4, 2008, at 7:33 AM

Melange, you and Hellomynameis, are still leaving out one little important factor. The person doing the trespassing is armed with a lethal weapon (aka our friendly hunter)

Think about it! If you were to wake up and see an "unknown" man in your yard at 5:30AM with a lethal weapon in his hands. Wouldn't that startle you just a bit? Don't sugar coat this.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Tue, Mar 4, 2008, at 8:04 AM

Melange -- Hellomynameis. are you two attorneys? Have you had diverse study in prosecutorial type of law?

Again, you are forgetting the individual (aka hunter) is carrying a lethal weapon. *IF* the property owner was "reasonably" in fear for his life is what the prosecution will look for.

Honestly, until you have worked in a courtroom and have dealt with the manipulation of words, then you don't have a clue. Like I said last night. I would *gladly* take that bet any day for as much as anyone in here wants

to bet for.

Lets say for your sake Melange, that the person has posted "No Trespassing" signs on their property? What's your feelings then?

Here is the law as posted last night by Hellomynameis:

"he or she reasonably **not the word reasonably** believes such force to be necessary to defend himself or herself or a third person from what he or she reasonably believes to be the use or imminent use of unlawful force by such other person"


"Such force is used against a person who unlawfully enters, remains after unlawfully entering, or attempts to unlawfully enter a dwelling, residence, or vehicle lawfully occupied by such person"

Again, I will offer both of you legal scholars the chance to define "reasonably" for me.

Hellomynameis declined to do this last night.

-- Posted by Shiva_God_of_Death on Tue, Mar 4, 2008, at 8:36 AM

shiva, you go ahead and kill someone on your property who is offering no threat to your physical well being. You will be the one in court, not me.

I would be interested to know who your CCW class instructor was.

-- Posted by Hellomynameis on Tue, Mar 4, 2008, at 9:11 AM

High school diploma or GED? I've known students who slept the entire 4 years of high school and were GIVEN a diploma. Once being graduated, they could neither write a simple sentence or read Dick & Jane with comprehension. One is not given a GED certificate for sleeping.

-- Posted by iago on Tue, Mar 4, 2008, at 10:13 AM

Shiva and Mary Jo

You choose your statements in the name of convenience. Ask any cop about the difference between pointing a gun and pulling a trigger. When you commit you had better be right.

Well a Harley and a .40cal toy. Ewwwww...Spooky! I gave up my Harley when all of the wannabes started buying them. I sold mine for $5000 more than I gave for it 4 years before new.

I prefer my .45 glock but am waiting for the .50 to be developed. The desert Eagle is a nice gun but will jam and I don't like revolvers. A Glock will not jam as long as you take care of it. For the home my grandfathers 12 ga. shorty is the best but dangerous because of its age.

-- Posted by Who Me? on Tue, Mar 4, 2008, at 7:46 PM

Respond to this story

Posting a comment requires free registration: