The Obama layoffs have begun.
I went into survival mode after the last election and now going into shut down mode.
BTW anyone thinking of doing this need to get started with a good financial planner. It takes a while if you don't want to give you retirement to Uncle Sam.
Wednesday morning I called my 401k plan and cashed out. Gonna take the tax hit and put it all in a Folgers can, that is after I purchase a few survival items. Won't catch me on TV whining for Gov't help. Food for at least 3 months,swimming pool full of water, plenty of propane, generator gas, lots of small denomination money,etc. Not to mention guns and ammo. Don't be coming up my lane when you see the lights on!
And some are planning on moving to Canada. Bye.
Canada... low debt, low deficits, low crime, no financial crisis, abundant energy (and not afraid to develop it)... Sounds terrible.
You wouldn't fit in Canada - they don't tolerate anti-whites and anti-male people.
And free health care.
Trade surplus. 2nd largest country. bilingual.
Look up, it will get better. The world did not end.
And free health care. -- Posted by username1 on Fri, Nov 9, 2012, at 10:36 PM
Ahhh.... the big liberal lie. "Free" health care. Where does it come from, the tooth fairy? This about sums up the logic in most of your posts.
The above is an informed opinion and NOT intended to be professional advice. -- Posted by Me'Lange on Sat, Nov 10, 2012, at 6:10 AM
That's good because there are many, many other considerations in a personal decision than a 10% penalty and taxation.
1) If Obama makes a massive increase in taxes on those earning more then $250,000 - his stated goal - and your 401k puts you way up into that then maybe cashing it out now is better than giving more to the government after January 1st.
2) If you have a hefty mortgage with high interest payments are you better off taking the interest deduction until you retire or are you better off paying it off with your 401k.
3) Just because a 401k is "tax deferred" doesn't mean you won't pay taxes on your disbursements when you withdraw after 59 1/2 or later. It's still taxable income - and no one knows what Obama is capable of. He is clearly a big tax liberal.
And of course numerous other considerations that I didn't even list.
I cashed out some of mine several years ago, with no penalty due to age, was going to have to take payouts anyway soon due to age. Paid the taxes with a credit carry forward due to donations and invested the money in farm ground. Best move I made. The farm ground is worth more now and the fund is worth less.
I would not advise sticking it in a sock though as paper will burn one way or the other. In a fire and in case of wild inflation which we can look forward to. If you are going to hold it yourself, better look at something worth something instead of paper dollars, which are worthless if the government decides to make them so. Gold, Silver, Precious Stones, etc. And preferably something only you and trusted family members know you have.
Thanks for everyone's concern over "cashing out".
Modest 401k to say the least. Old enough to avoid 10%.
Been into gold since 1980. Just need to get it out of the safety deposit box and into a Folgers can. No mortgage, no credit cards, no problems.
Sounds like you got it covered.
Oh, I forgot to add. "You didn't build that." Someone helped you. :-)
Ahhh.... the big liberal lie. "Free" health care. Where does it come from, the tooth fairy? This about sums up the logic in most of your posts.
-- Posted by Dug on Sat, Nov 10, 2012, at 9:07 AM
I was making one of your puns. Ugh - kinda thought you'd get it. Gave you too much credit I guess.
"Those claiming to layoff employees because of a presidential election is simply making excuses for their own guilt/shame as a result of their own poor performance aka running away from their personal responsibilities."
These people are not laying off employees because of an election.... they are laying off people because of who won the election. Obama is anti-business, they know it, and they expect 4 more years of the same.
I also have owned two business. One, I sold, the other will be 50 years old in the Spring.
You either pun or lie all the time about "free" health care. You seem to believe it's free. I would expect that from someone who gets paid by the taxpayers.
Jerking your chain - it's fun.
scared of the future, Send me $45 a month and I will be happy to care about your healthcare. :)
Me'Lange, I'm thinking of investing my entire $300 retirement nest egg in shovels bound to be in big demand when those shovel ready jobs begin!
Would that be a recommendation as a safe harbor for my similar nest egg?
Heathcare in Victoria,Canda is $45 a month per person. Don't know what that covers. That's what one resident up there told us. -- Posted by scared of the future on Sun, Nov 11, 2012, at 8:12 AM
There are some significant differences between the Canadian form of health care and Obamacare.
The Canadian system is run by the provinces (states) - not the federal government. They have pretty high "sin" taxes and it's not unusual for a case of beer to run $40. Cigarette taxes are very high as well. The cost of fuel (gas) is very very high compared to the US yet they have an abundance of oil and reserves for as small a country as they are. Also, the wait lines for medical care are a nightmare. I've yet to meet a Canadian that doesn't complain about waiting months and even a year or more for non-emergency treatment.
We have a new system with fines and penalties and the focus for payment is "tax the rich". Who knows where this system will end up eventually but I can confidently predict that full-scale Obamacare will erode service and treatment. We will see I guess.
Dug - can attest to the Canadian taxes.
IIRC, during my visits in 2008, the regular sales tax on food, etc. was in the 14% range, a can of dip/snuff ran close to 10$ (the Canadians, or at least the Quebec-ians, put their dollar-sign after the fact), and a 40oz bottle of beer was 4$-something, plus tax on top of that. Fuel was 1.37$ per liter at a time when it was in the low-$2 range per gallon here. The exchange rate was about US$0.90 to 1$CAD.
Was advised to take my insurance card, and to look up the nearest provider that accepted it - which turned out to be about 40 miles away. Thankfully, didn't need to try it out.
A very nice place to visit, but a good place to be FROM.
The poor and middle class will be the losers with Obamacare. There will still be plenty of docs not taking medicare/medicade offering specialized medical services for the folks that can afford it.
As more and more docs are subject to governmnet price fixing, more and more will retire early to get out of the federal beaucracy of red tape and payment delays.
The new program focuses on controlling who pays and does not address the cost of medical service.
There is a market for low cost no thrills basic health care being suppressed with government interference.
-- Posted by Me'Lange on Sun, Nov 11, 2012, at 1:42 PM
Limiting % of profit on anything might be good in your opinion Comrade but a horrible exercise of power on the part of government in a free market country (At least up until now).
We are loosing the freedoms so many fought to maintain... and we are our own worst enemy.
Your ideas are what lead to dicratorships where eventually we are all equal. Equally as poor and deprived of services that is.
I believe when we limit our brightest from going into a profession that rewards them in a way compatible with their talents, we are going to get less than our brightest going into the health care field. Is that a goal to be strived for?
I remember you saying to get use to the wallpaper in the waiting room.
In Canada most doctors have a cap they can make and then it has to be free or take off. Most take off.
People up there are tickled to death to get another doctor in their area. You think Cape is bad just wait until the docs cut their working time in half.
This is probably old news..............but for those who have not noticed. Many doctors in this area have shut down their private practices and now are contract employees of the hospitals.
"that the doctor is getting a kick- backs, such as free lunches, Ski trips"
Lunches are being eliminated for staff. They cant even give a doctor an ink pen much less ski trips?
In a perfect world, doctors would be doctors because they value serving the well being of others. They could still be rewarded nicely, v. ridiculously.
For 8 extra years of higher education then internship? $1750,000 is not worth it when these intelligent kids can find better pay for less time and cost in other fields. These kids are not doing it so Common can get some free healthcare. Do you think the average kid can do the job? If so I hope you get them instead of me.
And finally, Medicare doesn't pay very well at all.
~~Wheels, In a perfect world, doctors would be doctors because they value serving the well being of others. They could still be rewarded nicely, v. ridiculously.
-- Posted by Me'Lange on Sun, Nov 11, 2012, at 5:29 PM
Some Doctors do today what they do because of their dedication. I was fortunate enough to have one do two successful knee replacements several years ago. But he has a right to be paid according to his skill level.
But others perfectly capable may take another look at a profession that artifically limits their compensation.
You act as if the world is a collection of thieves. Assuming this to be the case. Where in the government group of thieves are you going to find people with the brains and honesty to set the pay scale for these "Greedy" doctors without lining their own pockets from lobbiests.
Regarding this perfect world business, I had a couple of female employees in my business life try that goofy argument on me when I demanded a higher level of accuracey in what they did. After I explained my perfect world theory they dropped that tact.
There is no perfect world and going the Marxist route is not going to make it so. I prefer living in a world where everybody is compensated according to the effort he/she puts into his/her occupation and what level of skill they reach. I do not see downgrading people's salaries just so those that are only willing to put the minimum effort into a job, or worse prefer to sit on their arse, gripe and draw government money feel better and have adequate and cheap medical care.
Certainly medical care has risen rapidly in recent years, but look at the advances in medicine that has gone along with it.
Study the Amana Colonies sometime and see what making everyone more equal gets you. They had to make huge changes in their structure where a strong central figure regulated everything in their daily lives. From where they lived to where they worked. People only tolerate that so long and then they rebel.
The beliefs of the "pigs" in George Orwell's "Animal Farm" are alive and well today.
In this way, Orwell makes the point that totalitarianism need not be blatant in order to be operating. It can hide under the guise of the "greater good" as it did in the Soviet Union before the totalitarianism became obvious.
So for the "greater good" we need to artificially cut the pay of top physicians because their service - highly skilled open heart surgery or brain surgery - is a "utility" function.
Mel - you get your brain surgery with a "utility" physician. I'll take the highly talented, hard working millionaire physician myself.
"We Regret said: "Medicare doesn't pay very well at all." Pay whom?"
"~My parents and grandparents are/were very happy with their coverage. All spend the dough on a good Medicare e did too along with long term care.
"~Or did you mean what they pay the doctor? Medicare payment for a Rural healthcare clinic are contractually negociated. In other words, the doctor agrees to a pre-set fee. Which in this area is about $63 bucks per visit, plus the senior or their supplement on the hook for 20% of the bill, roughly $28 to 44 per visit."
Not anywhere good money. You figure their labor and overhead and tell me what kind of big bucks they make.
Remember, I have docs in the family. I know the bottom line.
Regret said "Lunches are being eliminated for staff. They cant even give a doctor an ink pen much less ski trips?"
"Oh how gullable you are! Cars, boats, vacations, lunches, country club memberships -- you name it, it has and will continue to happen. These large companies find ways around the law."
Here we go again. Those mean corporations.
No they cant. Legally pharmaceutical companies cannot give things to doctors. I'm not gullible I am in the know on this subject.
If you know of this happening there are big rewards available to you. The law started in 2009. No pharma company is NOT going to risk a $250,000 fine to give a pen or sticky notes to a doc. All you have to do is ask your doc the next time you visit.
-- Posted by Me'Lange on Mon, Nov 12, 2012, at 5:27 AM
So based on *possible* criminal activity we should cut all physician pay arbitrarily?
Makes as much sense as branding all teachers "predators" since a miniscule minority have relationships with their students. Cut all teacher pay because of the few criminal teachers?
How much should an eye surgeon make Me'Lange? $50,000/year? $100,000/year? $25,000 year? Who should decide - a federal board? Cost of living in NY vs. Cape Girardeau?
The federal government can't run a postal service effectively. It amazes me how many people think they should set our salaries and run our lives.
I cannot help but to be overwhelmed by the percentage of the U.S. population who appear to be on one or more 'permanent' prescriptions. Elderly patients sometimes find themselves taking dozens of prescriptions. Some of the prescriptions are given to counteract the side-effects of other prescriptions. Yet, since it is impossible to know exaclty how any one drug will affect the actions of another drug or group of drugs, it's difficult to know which sypmtoms are side effects, and from which drug the side-effects are produced.
The statistics for those who suffer severe medical problems or death because they mis-use prescription drugs is alarming. Doctors will often prescribe certain drugs that must be taken hours apart to avoid interaction, but the patients will ignore or forget that requirement and basically poison themselves with their own cure. Also, many drugs should not be taken with over-the-counter medications, and yet patients still consider over-the-counter medications as safe to take whenever, and they will combine prescription and non-prescription drugs in lethal combinations.
The Elderly have worked a lifetime .
They should receive anything they need free .
-- Posted by .Rick. on Mon, Nov 12, 2012, at 10:00 AM
I'm sorry, but I cannot agree with that. We have enough welfare cases on our hands already. Social Security was supposed to be the vehicle to take people off what was called an "Old Age Pension". I can vaguely remember my Grandparents talking about it when I was very young.
So people in too many cases believed everything the lying politicians told them through the years about how social security would do this or do that and squandered their earnings as they went through life. Now we are going to take on that burden also? I am quickly approaching 75 years old and I do not see it.
username1: Nothing is free as you put it somebody down the line is paying for it. Santa Claus will be coming to a end here as soon as Congress goes back in session after the first of the year. The President and the Speaker are already talking entitlement reform from top to bottom thank goodness on that especially Welfare. The EBT Card Santa Claus is about to be downgraded and many investigated for fraud. Wheels what many of these people who actually believe and have in there minds that this give me and give me goes on forever but trust me it is about to come to an end the President never has to run again so he does not have to cater to the far left base he will come to the middle of the road and bring the axe out along with congress. So the freeloaders that have been sitting on there butts for the past four years I suggest you better get out and find yourself a job because Santa Glaus is going back to the north pole.
-- Posted by .Rick. on Mon, Nov 12, 2012, at 12:15 PM
Actually, the EPA declare that carbon dioxide - the air you exhale - is a greenhouse gas. Expect it to be taxed soon.
You should have been more like this Genealogy friend's uncle. Upon looking up his military records he found that his one uncle had served just 7 days in the army before being discharged. Reason given for discharge.... 'chronic alcoholism'.
Try all you want. I invest in the pharma industry. I looks like now since Obamacare is happening I will be dumping some of once the good up and coming products in the pipeline that will be rejected by socialized medicine as cost prohibitive for the elderly. They will be sold to overseas firms.
Now you show where a company got caught and say "See that's what they all are doing". In that case all bookkeepers are guilty of embezzlement. There are unscrupulous companies in any field. The doc's that accept them is just as guilty.
You say: "We Regret, Next time you go to your doctor, all you have to do is look around the office and an exam room and you will prove that your own statement is incorrect."
Prove that and let me know the brand name and I will split the reward with you. Tell me what you see.
Mel, I know this field up and down and have made good returns on my investments by knowing these things.
The reason drugs are so high is the regulations and time restraints after patents have been applied for.
Note pads and pens are out. The $100 rule ended long ago replaced by a $25 rule then no gifts as such. Yes brochures and wall posters showing various educational information is allowed.
One company gave doctors a TOPS baseball card with Cal Ripken 6 years ago and had to ask for them back because the card would be worth more in the future. That came from a friend of mine that is a drug rep
Last month my cardiologist showed me how the valves in my heart works using one of the posters given to them by Bristol Myers. I'm glad he had it. I guess someone needs to go to jail. Big pharma is in trouble now.
The government should pay for all of that stuff or maybe it is better if people didn't know and Obamacare could just tell people they don't have anything that will help them so they can hurry up and die as a cost measure.
How amny and who are breaking the laws? Substantial doesn't get it.
"Shapley, Many who are not "elderly" take dozens of prescriptions, OTC and supplements daily."
I'm aware of that, but my focus is on the elderly, whose drug use seems to be on the rise since the inception of Medicare Part D. Is this rise driven by medical necessity or by the availbility of monies?
"It is oftentimes a necessary evil."
And it is oftentimes just an evil, in my humble opinion.
"Ultimately, the patient will pay the price for a mistake, thus IMO it is their responsibility to assure what they are taking-- prescriptions, supplements and OTC-- are safe."
But many are in no conditon to take that responsibility, particularly if the driving condition or the side-effects are mental imbalances, depression, loss of cognition, etc.
Yes, I'm all for personal responsibility. But I believe there are those who simply keep some patients sedated and supplied, unaware perhaps that the drugs they are using are prolonging or exacerbating their condition, rather than improving it. This is common when we seek to treat they symptoms of a problem rather than the cause.
"Many chronic illnesses beget a pile of medication and supplements- morning, noon and night."
And many medications begat a pile of illnesses, in my humble opinion.
"Shapley, I'm not really disagreeing with your perspective, just offering both sides of the discussion."
I understand that.
It is difficult, when writing on these threads, to convey everything one wants to say. I'm not opposed to medicine, though my posts may sound that way, I'm opposed to the over-prescribing of it. I'm not opposed to doctors, but I there are good doctors and bad doctors. Some doctors strike me as being little more than licensed pill-pushers.
We condemn the street pusher for condemning people to a lifetime addicted to mind- and body-altering drugs. But license physicians to do the same. Perhaps we need to rethink this.
There are about 3 billion prescriptions written annually in the United States, which equates to about 8 prescriptions per citizen in this country. Now, I realize most of those are short-term, 5-day and 10-day antibiotic doses, short-term cold remedies, and so on. But many are long-term, and many of the short term ones could be eliminated by changing diet or lifestyles.
It's generally not considered a good idea to subidize bad behaviour. Yet, that is what we do when we provide public funding for prescription drugs to treat the effects of poor choices.
We Regret, I think we have exhausted our discussion, given neither of us have all the answers.
-- Posted by Me'Lange on Tue, Nov 13, 2012, at 3:04 A
OK. Thanks for agreeing with me.
But many are long-term, and many of the short term ones could be eliminated by changing diet or lifestyles. -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Tue, Nov 13, 2012, at 6:57 AM
I am pretty averse to long-term prescriptions. I know a lot of folks that take cholesterol medicine and other prescriptions for years and probably the rest of their lives. I'm sure they help extend life but I just don't like long term medicine.
I was taking a cholesterol medicine at one time and my liver enzymes jumped through the roof. The doctor kept asking me about drinking and I told him I rarely if ever drink. The medicine was raising the enzymes to very high levels. I simply quit taking it. You can die from heart attack or liver failure I guess.
I was having gastro-instestinal troubles a few years back. The doctor wanted to put me on the purple pill, which I would have to take daily. I said I wouldn't take a pill daily, did he have something that could be taken only when I had flare-ups? He gave me a prescription for something, which he told me would be effective but would mean a couple of hours of discomfort before they kicked in.
I have yet to take one of the pills. I changed my diet and the problems went away, sans medication. I think I finally threw the unopened bottle of pills away when I last cleaned out the medicine cabinet.
"Gonna take the tax hit and put it all in a Folgers can, that is after I purchase a few survival items."
-- Posted by dab1969 on Fri, Nov 9, 2012, at 6:49 PM
For what it's 'worth'...I would take that fiat currency and buy silver coin. By time Obummer is through, you'll be glad you did. Here's a link to an article about it on "The Power Hour": http://www.thepowerhour.com/news4/cabool...
You can order through this guy, Joshua Deatherage, for a good deal or look into becoming a partner maybe: firstname.lastname@example.org
I know Joshua and he's a good fellow.
Thanks dchannes. I moved all my "funds" out of the stock market several months before the election. I'm looking to get into silver currency.
Is it true that currency "gains" cannot be taxed because it's not legal for the government to tax currency? Not that they would know what I paid and sold if for anyway, but I've heard that.
My cardiologist said 50% of the time he can fix someone with diet and some exercise. He said the main problem is people are lazy and wont do it and still eat the big macs.
You are right about the cholesterol medicines. They can do more damage than good.
I invest in life saving and quality of life medications such as Parkinson's and Alzheimer's drugs. Hopefully none of us will ever need them.
Here goes anther one Obama cant save.
Uh Oh another 1170 jobs gone.
you are crazy
Oh oh, they must have let Caddy out.
I was wondering what happened to you. Glad you are back!!!! You must have really put one on after the election.
Just wondering if Caddie and the "people" are still waiting for that phone call from the Obama campaign thanking them for the support.
No need to feel bad. The people will again be able to feel important as soon as the democrats start up their next political season promising to fix all the woes of the people that they themselves have inflicted.
Biden has a horrible history balancing his own financials. I would think that would sway people but if you are just looking for your government check to keep coming he would probably be your man.
A doctor in Springfield said he closing up shop. "With this Obama Care, I won't be able to pay my bills".
We'll see how fun this free care is when it takes 4 months to get an appointment for a G.P.
You're welcome. I have some silver. Not enough...but some. :) I can buy pizza, tires, health foods, and auto repairs over here with silver Community Dollars. I like spending it too. Feels good.
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