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Home » Forums » Speak Out

Speak Out: History : A long Lesson

Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 8:55 AM:

In the earliest excavations of ancient Troy, it was discovered that the people were untidy housekeepers. Whatever garbage they accumulated was left on the floor, and covered with a layer of clay. When the garbage got to be about ankle deep, they put down another layer of clay. When the floor was raised so high that they had to crouch, they cut the roof off the house, and raised the roof.

Later cultures threw their garbage into the street, for the pigs and other animals to eat, and for it to be trod underfoot by passers by. However, there being no street cleaning services, the result of this was that the older houses 'sank', or rather the streets around them raised so that the older homes became lower than the streets around them. Thus, after a while, they would remove the roof and build a second floor atop the old home.

Archeologists love this kind of sloppiness, as it gives them a measure of how people lived, what they ate, and how long they remained.

There aren't any clever sayings that spring from that, as far as I know, but I found it interesting.

My family and I took a tour of Charleston, SC, and took one of those haunted walking tours. They told us the 'graveyard shift' story. They claimed that the practice of sitting up in the graveyard all night came about because it was easier to hear the bells in the dead of night than during the hubbub of the day.

Replies (279)

  • Things they forget to tell us in History class! I could never figure out why History, English and American literature, and math has to be made so boring that many students only learned a lifetime adversion to them.

    -- Posted by voyager on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 8:55 AM

  • Neat, RICK! Thanks for taking the time to start the thread. Wonder how long it can stay basically NON-political? I'm gettin' burned-out on politics here, lately. Glad I got here, before it starts gettin' too "personal", like always.

    (But I'm a bettin' man! Gentlemen---and ladies---place your bets! I'll give it 'til 2:15 p.m.-today, before "The Change" takes place...☺!)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 10:56 AM

  • I've heard the theory that garbage was what made dogs out of wolves.

    Every lasting gathering place of man had a garbage area where wolves and other animals came to scavage. Over a long time the wolves with the least instinct of flight at the sight of humans evolved into a tamer breed later domesticated.

    I knew of a guy that had a Datsun in the early years of Japanese imports. This guy was very rich and bought the thing just out of curiosity. When the steering broke, the little gear needed for repair had to come from the factory. Rather than wait, he hired a plane to go after the part. The factory was so impressed that they gave him a whole boxfull.

    As the plane passed over Arkansas the cargo door accidently came open spilling the little gears into the sky.

    A farmer below said "Look Ethyl, it's raining Datson Cogs!".

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 11:28 AM

  • Old John,

    You know how Datsun got it's name I suppose?

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 11:32 AM

  • Dat soon?

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 11:43 AM

  • Old John,

    So, you don't believe that wild poodles once roamed the Serengeti, only to be tamed by early man?

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 11:59 AM

  • I know that, in the Hawaii's early days, King Kamehameha I waged war on the surrounding Islands. He celebrated each victory by returning to his home with the throne of the vanquished king. As his collection of thrones grew, he began to store them on the roof of his hut. One evening the thatched roof collapsed, and King Kahehameha was crushed under the weight of those seized thrones.

    Thus was born the saying: "Man who lives in grass house should not stow thrones", although it has been altered over the years.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 12:06 PM

  • Old John,

    Getting a better idea of your age all of the time.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 1:05 PM

  • Wheels, As a youngster I was put in my place one time when a fellow reminded me "He's forgot more about it than all you know about it" I'm old enough to understand how that works now.

    The forgot part, that is.

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 1:22 PM

  • (But I'm a bettin' man! Gentlemen---and ladies---place your bets! I'll give it 'til 2:15 p.m.-today, before "The Change" takes place...☺!)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 10:56 AM

    donknome-2,

    Good think nobody took you up on this one. You would have lost. And it did seem like such a safe bet too. ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Fri, Dec 10, 2010, at 5:54 PM

  • Good Lord, I'm totally stunned!

    But it's OK---I went back and double-checked, an' noticed I hadn't committed any "cash-funding" to my wager.(Whew!!!)

    Amazing how soon forum-subjects "drop", once they don't seem to support the matters of political corruption, government conspiracies, and sex-scandals.

    Notice I left out "Political-Correctness", though. I had to---otherwise, RICK's-explanation of "Store-High-In-Transit" may have been taken as offensive by some union-shippers, in some way?(I'll accept that as an actual "proof-of-origin", until otherwise shown!) That's gotta be an original, ain't it, RICK???

    Many years ago, a lawyer with a rather "dry" sense of humor, explained to me the fine-line one must walk, when it comes down to a matter of libel/slander suits. He told me: "Now, you have to be careful with what you say about your adversary---you can call him an a**-hole, simply because we all have one. But, you can NOT call him a son-of-a-b***h, because there is no way that you can PROVE, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that his mother was an actual DOG!"

    This advice obviously was given BEFORE the days of widely-spread use of DNA-results were acceptable in court.

    Hey, it's just as much the "gospel-truth" as "Store-High-In-Transit" is....!!!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 11:15 AM

  • Yeah, OK---It was STOW-High-In-Transit, instead!

    Either way, I still think it's a load of---well---SSSSSSSSS-trike ONE....!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 11:23 AM

  • Another maritime saying " cold enough to freeze the balls off a brass monkey". The brass monkey held the stacked cannon balls. In cold weather the brass being a soft metal began to conrtract. The brass monkey would get so cold and contract the bottom balls would roll out of the indentations on the monkey. I do believe this is

    the phrases origin. However, I doubt it ever happened! I believe the old ships tilt would have played more havoc on the stacks of balls then cold ever would on brass.

    Another good one is the phrase, " I gave him the whole nine yards"

    Anyone want to share that phrases origin?

    -- Posted by GREYWOLF on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 5:17 PM

  • I have heard the "Stow High in Transit" explanation before.

    The whole nine yards refers to the fact that warplanes used to carry 27 feet of ammunition as a basic load. It is a pilot term "I gave him the whole 9 ...

    This is according to Answers.Com. I had heard it somewhere before but had forgotten.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 6:33 PM

  • True, 'WOLF---but the non-maritime version still sounds a lot colder, to me!

    I always wondered about the "whole nine-yards" myself?

    I'd LOVE to start-in with some "bathroom-walls-wisdom"---but I'm pretty certain Mr. Moderator wouldn't go for it!☺

    And if you even attempted to "cool-'em down" to a publishable-level, it'd ruin them, because so much would be lost in "translation"......!☺!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 6:35 PM

  • 9-times-3 equals 27. Yeah, that sounds good to me, too! I'll take that as "indisputable", until someone can prove different!

    And as for our "Stow"-away subject: I wonder if they happened to ship it in "Big-Crocks", as well???☺!

    (BTW, WHEELS: I caught another of your "vernacular-wonders" the other day---"...don't get your bowels in an uproar!" I always thought that'n had my Grandma's copyright on it! Her an' my Mom always traded that one back an' forth...!☺)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 6:45 PM

  • "Coming down the pike" I think came from the St. Louis World's Fair.

    Did "kick the bucket" come from the Chicago fire?

    He was "all stoved up"; where did that come from?

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 7:29 PM

  • Ummmm, donknome-2, don't remember where I heard that one first.... but it was quite a while ago, and Grandma hasn't been around for a long time either????? At a loss unless we have a common relative, and that would not be impossible. I hail from Bollinger County originally, but that also has been a long time ago.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 7:30 PM

  • Donknome-2,

    You don't suppose your Grandma would hit me up on a copyright infringement suit do you? ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 7:32 PM

  • Tried to look up the origin of 'the whole nine yards' - it seems nobody knows for sure, at least out in the Internet world.

    Best agreement is that the phrase didn't come into regular usage before 1964, which seems to eliminate claims of origin during WWII, or the 15th century monks and the fabric required for their robes.

    Concrete truck capacity was one suggestion, as well as the number of shipbuilding locations, or 'yards'. The long jump record being set at 27' 3" during that time was another suggestion. The amount of fabric required for a tailor-made suit as well as the Vietnam guys with a suggestion of the length of ammunition belts is still being reviewed.

    Eh, still poking around - good question!

    -- Posted by fxpwt on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 7:42 PM

  • Old John,

    The following I also found on Answers.Com;

    "Die, as in All of my goldfish kicked the bucket while we were on vacation. This moderately impolite usage has a disputed origin. Some say it refers to committing suicide by hanging, in which one stands on a bucket, fastens a rope around one's neck, and kicks the bucket away. A more likely origin is the use of bucket in the sense of "a beam from which something may be suspended" because pigs were suspended by their heels from such beams after being slaughtered, the term kick the bucket came to mean "to die." [Colloquial; late 1700s]"

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 7:47 PM

  • Thanks Wheels. I have heard that "cranky" came from difficulties in starting the model T. Folks tended to give a personality to there cars back then such as cold natured and cranky.

    Now's the time for someone to say that relates to an ex and explain "Gave me a cold Shoulder".

    Mom made pies from "scratch" and some of us still "eat crow".

    There are so many new terms today that the ones to survive will have to root hog or die.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 9:02 PM

  • Well, coal trucks in New England originally had three sections that contained three cubic yards of coal apiece. If you anticipated a bitterly cold winter, naturally you asked for the whole nine yards.

    -- Posted by We Regret To Inform U on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 10:33 PM

  • How about "eat humble pie"? Or not to "give a diddledee squat or a tinker's dam." Or being "as useful as the hind teat on a boar hog"?

    -- Posted by voyager on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 10:38 PM

  • Somebody needs a wailing for starting this 9 yards stuff. I was getting ready for bed and now I am glued to the computer looking this stuff up. Thanks for messing up my dreams.

    -- Posted by We Regret To Inform U on Sat, Dec 11, 2010, at 10:38 PM

  • Go raise the welks on GREYWOLF---he started the "whole-nine-yards" of it!☺ All of these explanations sound plausible, maybe it's a "regional-thang"! I guess it's Pick-Your-Poison?(Heh, THAT one fell-out, an' I weren't even tryin'!)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 8:38 AM

  • That should probably be "welts", instead---just more of my Mothers'-slang! To her, "gas" was always "gayze". Me an' Dad about went blind once, when we were assigned "grocery-list-duties", whilst she was laid-up once. Spelling was NOT one of her priorities!☺

    "WHEELS", to be related to ME would NOT be a bragging-point, from YOUR side of the line!☺ I think you're safe---Grandma was raised around the "Sedge"-area of Bollinger County. And my Dad was born, "out in the sticks" of Pulaski County, Illinois.

    Me an' my oldest-sister were kinda the legendary "Black-Sheep" of the family. But since she passed-away awhile back, the duty of being the proverbial "burr under the saddle" of any survivors fell to ME afterwards...☺!!!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 9:02 AM

  • Me an' my oldest-sister were kinda the legendary "Black-Sheep" of the family. But since she passed-away awhile back, the duty of being the proverbial "burr under the saddle" of any survivors fell to ME afterwards...☺!!!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 9:02 AM

    Good Grief,

    What a responsibility.... but hey, you're up to it. ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    Ok, Since we probably aren't related, my relatives are from the Dutch/German communities of chicken and dumplings and kettle beef.

    Now we are going to have to research your Grandma's, my Grandma's or somebody's Grandma's favorite saying. Get back with me if you get it figured out.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 9:44 AM

  • Uhhhh Donknome-2,

    We have problems here in River City... I just googled our phrase and received 88,900 hits, I think it is safe to say, it was probably somebody else's Grandma.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 9:51 AM

  • Scuttlebutt from a Son of a Gun about a SNAFU could result in a File Thirteen.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 10:21 AM

  • Old John,

    You are speaking in parables this morning.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 10:54 AM

  • Ahh...The good ole days. Thanks for the walk down memory lane.

    -- Posted by Egotistical_Bigot on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 12:25 PM

  • Good afternoon Megalo.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 12:29 PM

  • WHEELS: Dunno about sayings, but Grandma's-version of breakfast(bacon, eggs "toasted" on a coal-fired stove) were certainly enough to "get your bowels in an uproar"---literally!!!

    I know very little about my paternal grandparents. She died shortly after my Dad was born, and his father just kind of, umm, disappeared after that. I do have their wedding picture, though---he, a dapper young man, and she, a beautiful dark-haired young lady, in a Victorian-style gown.

    My maternal grandfather died just before I was born---but Grandma was around for many a year afterwards, to corrupt my young-mind with her wisdom! My late Sister had just begun to research "Grandma #2"s lineage, but she passed-on before it was finished. She left me a binder-full of research that has to be six-inches thick, at least! But anymore, I don't have the mind let alone the resources, that she had for processing such.

    And as for being the perfect "burr under the saddle": Indeed, I must have the "gift", seeing as how the two direct blood-kin I have left in this world haven't acknowledged my existence since the day I signed-off all claims to my parents' estate. And in all honesty, I must say I prefer it that way, instead of them thinking they MUST associate, "just-because", you know.

    So indeed I must be doing something "wrongfully-right"...!!!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 1:15 PM

  • I'm still stuck on the "the whole nine yards" thing. I feel like a dog chasing his tail.

    -- Posted by We Regret To Inform U on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 2:09 PM

  • Donknome-2

    First the current crop of relatives thing.... I have always said, your friends you get to choose and your relatives are assigned to you. Not hard to figure out sometimes why the friends are the easiest to like. I believe Gurusmom told me one day... you don't need to feel obligated to your relatives just because of an accident of birth. Maybe not word for word... but you get the idea.

    Second, your lineage. That is something I have always like doing and it sounds like you have a real head start with what your sister left you. Hang onto it, you may want to dive in head first yourself one of these days. And tell you what you will find you probably like the dead relatives way better than the live ones. Guarantee you... they will cause you less trouble. I have a friend who is also looking at his family history. He and I get together and discusss what we have found in our respective searches and have a good laugh over the antics of some of our ancestors.

    Oh and those pictures you have... don't forget to make a note or two on the back as who the people are, and protect them jealously for your children if you have some. They are obviously not replaceable, the pictures I mean. ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 2:24 PM

  • I have been scanning many of our old pictures in case something happens to the originals and saving the backup hard drive in a fireproof safe and rotate them.

    -- Posted by Acronym on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 3:06 PM

  • WHEELS: "...obligated to relatives because of an accident of birth." HA!!! LOVE that one! Gotta write that one down---it may be an Historic-Saying itself, some day!

    As for lineage: One of my aunts, as she'd always put it, "shook the family-tree" years ago, looking for "Royalty" that she may have been related to in the 1800's. Instead, the four-royal "nuts" she shook-out were as follows: TWO had died in an insane-asylum. ONE was nothing short of a card-cheat---who paid the price, that is! And, the final ONE was nothing short of a back-shooting murderer---which is the way it way generally done in those days.(Allegedly stayed alive long enough to die of the Spanish-flu epidemic, though!)

    Needless to say---she STOPPED "shaking the tree"!

    As for the PHOTOS: Nope, no children to pass them along to, but if I did? They'd have quite a collection. Most of the "really-old" pictures are your standard, bleached-brownish cardboard prints. But, about two-dozen of them are the original "tin-types", ranging from fair-to-excellent condition. Are they "Bradys"??? I honestly don't know, I see no definite-proof of his work on them. But, there weren't that many others who worked with that process during the mid-to-late 1800's, were there? Range in size from palm-to-small-frame sizes. Either way, they strike me with awe, as to how "it used to be" done...!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 6:17 PM

  • Acronym,

    I also have been scanning all of the old photos I can find. We have had several sessions where different family members brings pictures they have inherited from parents and scanned them.

    Lot of work but worth it and I have made CDs for the others and asked for help getting names. Names come a little harder and everyone is not in total agreement always, but we are slowly getting some things save for posterity.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 7:41 PM

  • If the sherrif says "I'll fix your wagon!", you may have "a big nut to crack".

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 7:44 PM

  • Donknome-2

    Mom gets credit for that saying, it wasn't mine. But yes it is kind of a classic.

    And yes when you start shaking the tree sometimes more than leaves fall out. The fact that you may have a few original "characters" in your background just spices things up.

    You show me a true genealogist who claims there are no skeletons in his/her closet ever, and I will show you someone who may lie about other things as well. And we all know you can go to hell for lying just as well as stealing. ☺ ☻ ☺ ☻

    Now you have another problem. Those pictures, you simply must find someone to pass them on to.

    I cannot help you with the details on the various types of pictures. Obviously things improved and changed over time, and I have seen the cardboard ones, the tintypes, the ones where someone pulled a person out of a group and made a tinted portrait out of it. But, I know little of the history of the processes that took place however. Maybe I will put that on my bucket list to look into.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 7:56 PM

  • Old John,

    You simply have to stop "loading our wagon" with new old sayings. We are about to hit overload on trying to find origins of the sayings.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 7:58 PM

  • Wheels, Can you remember a time at a big family holiday meal when you over filled and excused yourself from the table before the adults, only to return to the table after the adults left to check out what you might have missed?

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 8:18 PM

  • Old John,

    I do... but those days are long past. I always had an appreciation for Jimmie Dickens and his song... "Take an old cold tater and wait". If it were an exceptionally large get together, kid types did not get fed first as they seem to have earned the right to do today.

    My wife and I stopped at a Mexican Restaurant the other evening and the food was excellent, but way more was served that should be eaten at one meal.

    So we spent the rest of the evening complaining because we ate too much.

    Old John, would you live those days over, given the chance? Those were the days when you never had a worry in the world. Our parents may have done more for us than we have been able to do for our own children in many ways.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 9:02 PM

  • Wheels, I think I have have hit upon a clue to your age.

    Old enough to forget about all those menacing and complexing worries of youth!

    I have yet to forget the anxieties, pressures, and awkwardness of youth's ultimate transition from not a care in the world to the distress of learning responsibilty. And remember this was while worldly feelings were at odds with spiritial sway.

    The funny thing is, even though I remember, I am thoroughly annoyed by the young folks of today that are not that different than I was. Why is that?

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Dec 12, 2010, at 9:23 PM

  • WHEELS: Yeah, "GURU" should copyright that one---NOW!!!

    Indeed, everyone has "fruits, nuts, an' berries" in their "tree". No, I'm not proud---but ain't ashamed, either!

    Now, Mom's-side was IRISH, all the way, as best me and Sis could tell---like I said, we didn't get it completed. Now, Dad's-side was AUSTRIAN,(pre-1900's) on BOTH his parents'-sides. So, his "history" was a lot easier to trace. And, yeah, he had a few "buggers" in his family-nosehairs, as well.

    (I'm "chompin' at the bit" to start-diggin' into my WIFES'-tree roots: Her family keeps the NORMAL-people in the closet, and lets the SKELETONS-out to rule!!!☺)

    I wonder if the County Archives Center would be interested in possession of all of those documents, research, AND pictures? After MY "meter" has expired, that is?

    Nope, don't know you, "WHEELS", nor you, "OLD JOHN"---but I'll bet if we did???

    Well, I've already been told where I'm goin' afterwards---but if any of you guys are goin' UP, or just hang around in the MIDDLE---I'll see you at the platform, where the SUBWAY stops to load.....!!!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 9:49 AM

  • I know I'm gonna jinx it, but here we are at #52, and what have we NOT seen??? Nobodys' "messed the nest"---yet!

    Well, that, and "RICK", who STARTED this particular thread!

    He's either ashamed of us---or, we've scared him away from his own thread...!!!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 9:55 AM

  • Old John,

    It's not all bad getting to the point where all you can remember about something was how good it was. ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    Regarding the annoying younger folks... it starts when they are born I think, especilly if they are your own kids. Now the Grandkids, that's a different story. They are easier to tolerate and when they get to be annoying you chase em home.

    Regarding my age Old Johm, I'm 39 and holding. Been holding for a little while now.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 10:08 AM

  • (I'm "chompin' at the bit" to start-diggin' into my WIFES'-tree roots: Her family keeps the NORMAL-people in the closet, and lets the SKELETONS-out to rule!!!☺)

    I wonder if the County Archives Center would be interested in possession of all of those documents, research, AND pictures? After MY "meter" has expired, that is?

    Nope, don't know you, "WHEELS", nor you, "OLD JOHN"---but I'll bet if we did???

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 9:49 AM

    Donknome-2

    Hmmmm. We might be brothers-in-laws here and not even know it.

    Yes, I think the Archieves would be tickled to death to get that stuff. If you are talking Marble Hill, I visit the Archieves quiet a bit and they have various family books and bits and pieces there. If you never get the inclination to finish your Sis's work, there is probably someone there that would put it into some kind of file that would be a type of memorial to your family. You might want to stop over there and talk to them someday. I think it would be a great idea.

    I would go along with your observations about knowing one another, but I bet if we could get together we could Wow one another with our brilliance... well maybe just Baffle one another with our BS!

    Now you take Rick over there in Jackson. He just sits back and listens to all of this BS he got started... and he'll have some homespun and wise to say before it is all over.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 10:21 AM

  • My Grandmother, although a very tolerant woman, did not take kindly to boasters. She had a regular visitor who was always bragging about her ancstors.

    One day the woman taxed Grandmother's patience beyond endurance.

    "My dear," Grandmother said in her most imperial voice, "it is not how proud we may be of our ancestors, but rather how proud they would be of us." History does not relate if the visitor ever brought up the subject again.

    Later I asked Grandmother if she thought the ancestors were proud of us.

    "Don't be impudent," she replied in that cold grey steel voice which said the subject was closed.

    -- Posted by voyager on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 10:26 AM

  • My father's elders had themselves convinced the family was of Irish and English decent. A lot of my mother's elders were still speaking German when she was little.

    A lot of patriotic folks of the second decade of twentieth century America did not flaunt their German heritage for obvious reasons.

    In the long run it turns out Dad's side was more German than Mom's since some of her family was welsch.

    -- Posted by Old John on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 10:38 AM

  • Old John, I had to go backl to the Eighteenth Century to find any German blood, and now I have found out they were Dutch instead. Otherwide, all English, Scottish and Scot-Irish.

    -- Posted by voyager on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 10:43 AM

  • I think my ancestors got kicked out of Holland for stealing hubcabs, sometime back in the 1850's mostly.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 10:51 AM

  • Spank,

    I've heard that before but have no idea where it comes from. Must have been from your Gramps side of the family... I was related to Grandma. ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    However... I would bet it was time to quit whatever you and your brother were doing, before you were shown some "true" love. ☻ ☻

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 11:06 AM

  • WHEELS: I'd probably be best-served to stick with the Archives in Cape County, since I live "just inside the border", on the Cape-county side. Had never really thought that much about it, until now. Indeed they might be interested, I mean, the research is all there, it just needs sorted.(What's the 25¢-word for that---is it "collate"?)

    Geez, since you've mentioned the "in-law"-word, you'll hafta endure THIS story, which I'm "kinda-sorta" proud of?

    As was mentioned, my "wifes-relatives" let the skeletons rule, an' pinned the normals inside the closet, instead. Upon completion of my soon-to-be-wifes third-date, her oldest, ugliest brother---the meanest, gnarliest-one, with the 14-karat earring---pulls a knife on me, and informs me to "leave or die".

    Now, I was a lot younger---and steadier!---then. Well, at first, I felt a shiver. But suddenly, without much thought at all, I done the most perfect "Indiana Jones"-move of my entire life to-date: I pulled-out the prettiest-little .31 caliber blackpowder "stagecoach" revolver---and shot that damned-earring right outta it's hole, with a minimal-amount of blood, but a LOT of soot!

    Last time I'd seen him was last year in an orange-jumpsuit, headin' for a long-"visit" to the state-ran "hotel" in Bowling Green, MO.

    And, by gawd if he wasn't STILL stumblin' around in circles off-balance, after all those years'-past.....!!!

    (Now, I'd swear to God it's true, but He ALREADY knows about it, so I figger the point would be moot, in a manner of speaking...!)☺!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 11:36 AM

  • Spank

    That is the problem now. They threw away the strap for DR. Spock's love.

    -- Posted by We Regret To Inform U on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 12:19 PM

  • Good Ol' Dr. Spock. I still remember a poem I saw in MAD Magazine about him:

    "Dr. Spock, Dr. Spock,

    Leads a peace march down the block.

    All around, everywhere you look

    are the kids he messed up with his book."

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 12:37 PM

  • Speaking of that, did anyone read the letter to Dear Abby in this weekend's paper from the teacher wanting mandatory parenting classes to keep parents from spanking their children? What rot!

    She says she can tell which children have been spanked by their aggressive behaviour and hostility towards others. My observation was the opposite. I've seen bullying by kids who lacked discipline.

    I recall attending a party once, when I was in the Navy, in which several of the attendees brought their children. One mean little fellow was running around tormenting the other kids. I saw him push a little girl down in the dirt and kick her while she was down. He then hit a friend of mine, an adult, with a bag of baseballs. My friend smacked him, and he ran off to tell his parents, both of whom were physicians.

    The mother approached my friend and said: "I understand that you disciplined our child?"

    My friend responded: "Hell, yes. The little ******* hit me with a bag of balls."

    The mother said: "We do not discipline him."

    My friend said: "That much is obvious!"

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 2:42 PM

  • Sounds to me like it was the parents who required disciplining.

    -- Posted by voyager on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 4:29 PM

  • Rick, you were a naughty boy. Nay, make that a b-a-a-d boy (as Lou Costello would say).

    -- Posted by voyager on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 4:49 PM

  • Fishin' line & trash cans. Dang, I'd never thought of that one!

    Didja' ever make a "light-bulb cannon" outta IGA Green-Bean cans? Engineering at it's finest!!!

    And, of course, there was always the old-standby: Mole-bombs made from a chunk of carbide an' a can of water. Kinda tricky to light though---unless you LIKED gettin' pelted by flyin' rocks-n'-roots...!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 6:25 PM

  • Man, we'd have made a GREAT-team, once upon a time!!!lol!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 7:11 PM

  • Donknome-2

    Dang, I guess we aren't brothers-in-laws after all. Wife only had one brother and he was gone by the time I started hanging around. I bet all that ear was good for was decoration and keeping his hat from falling down over his eyes at that point, no way he could've heard anything out of it any more.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 8:54 PM

  • ...me and my brother use to tie extra fine 2 lb. fishing line across the street to the trashcans..

    -- Posted by ...Rick on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 4:37 PM

    Did kind of the same thing but I tied a rope to a tree and to the mirror of my dads truck to trip my brother. My dad left for the store first. That one really hurt.

    -- Posted by We Regret To Inform U on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 9:14 PM

  • Fishing line and trash cans, "Light bulb" cannon, mole bombs, the twistyed tinfoil thing! I haven't got a clue what you're talking about, and I thought I was the meanest and sneakiest little brat in town.

    Of course, some of the stuff I DID do I shall keep quiet until my dying day since some of the victims may still be alive and willing to press charges. For some things there are not statute of limitations.

    -- Posted by voyager on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 9:16 PM

  • For some things there are not statute of limitations.

    -- Posted by voyager on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 9:16 PM

    Voyager,

    I think bruising your body might be one of those things the statute doesn't run out on. ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 10:55 PM

  • Voyager, Your victims have been laughing all these years and pretending to be clueless is your punishment.

    -- Posted by Old John on Mon, Dec 13, 2010, at 11:12 PM

  • This is kinda fun! Really! We get to be "kids" again! And to think it all started with a four-letter word like "history"!

    Oh no, I was quite proficient in MY spelling---but Mom could've made it in four-letters, I'm sure...!☺

    (78-and counting---and the nest is STILL relatively-clean! Or at least as much as can be expected, with a bunch of "reborn-kids" hangin' around here...!☺!)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Tue, Dec 14, 2010, at 10:43 AM

  • And, by the way, WHEELS---the bro-in-law must've retained some hearing. I mean after all, it DID get his attention!☺

    I own a few modern weapons, but I've always appreciated the(lack of)engineering, and the slower, heavier recoil of the cap-&-ball black-powder guns. That, and they are literally beautiful works of art, at least to me.

    I've loaded many a misfire on the rifles/pistols, but only if I was using Pyrodex. For the past several years, I only use REAL GOEX black-powder, with #11 Remington caps, now. Wish I could get a hi-res pic of that .31 cal. on here---it's a cute "little"-thang!

    (And, P.S.: I honest to God did love my father-in-law. Me an' him came to common-ground from the start---we were BOTH equally abrasive!☺ And, as for his one-an'-a-half-eared son? Told me I should've done that two-dates ago, already!)

    May that man rest in eternal peace---wherever he's waitin' at for me, on the other-side...!!!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Tue, Dec 14, 2010, at 11:40 AM

  • And I thought the big deal was a potato up the ole tailpipe or a watermelon rind under each back tire.

    -- Posted by Old John on Tue, Dec 14, 2010, at 11:45 AM

  • Oh, that'd still work OLD JOHN, but you'd hafta put the rinds under the FRONT-tires of most of todays' vehicles, an' use a plum for the pipe, no bigger than they are now!

    Besides, we ain't as quick as back then---we'd get caught, an' have our picture in the paper for it, now...!!!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Tue, Dec 14, 2010, at 12:23 PM

  • Donk, Did you ever take the cat with you into the corn crib when it was getting low and start tossing the ears to opposite side until mice decided it was time to leave? Now that was fun.

    You are probably right about the car pranks. First would be tampering with a motor vehicle followed by property destuction as the sheet metal crumpled and the bumpers bent when we all lifted the car.

    -- Posted by Old John on Tue, Dec 14, 2010, at 12:32 PM

  • Old John,

    I remember one of those early toy cars. Some kind of function going on in this church hall and a fair sized group of young lads picked up this buddy's new pride and joy, carried it through the double doors into the hall and then set it down in the corner. After which they piled up a couple of stacks of folding tables to the point it could not be seen.

    Cause quite a bit of consternation on the part of the owner of the car as I remember it. Everyone else thought it was fun though.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Tue, Dec 14, 2010, at 1:01 PM

  • Donknowme-2,

    When you visited your inlaws and stayed overnight... did you and your father-in-law have to take turns standing watch so that the rest of the family did not try to hurt your bodies?

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Tue, Dec 14, 2010, at 1:03 PM

  • WHEELS: STAY OVERNIGHT??? ARE YOU CRAZY???☺! No freakin' way! Even my WIFE refused to stay with them anymore, after "The Event"! It "ticked"-'em off to no end, when Dad-in-law would walk away from their threats to go fishing with me, and his soon-to-be-wed daughter! I swear to God, the man felt safer when HE stayed overnight with US! That wife of his was(ahem, still IS!)sufferin' from a case of "loose-screws"! Gawd, I wish I could tell you more, BUT---that'd be borderlining on slander! Not libel, though---'cause it's TRUE!

    OLD JOHN: (Keep an eye out for PETA, will ya'? 'Cause they ain't gonna like what I say next!!!)

    Gawd, I was born with cats! Indeed, when the cats got out-numbered, an' a few of the mice made a break for it across the barn lot---that's when me and my Red Ryder came into action! But those darn RATS needed more like .22-birdshot.(Dad wouldn't let me use the .22-Longs, 'cause I kept puttin' holes in the sheet-metal sides!☺ Same went for the pigeons in the barn-loft!) As for crunchin' cars by lifting? Maybe that's why kids are so bored nowadays: Ain't no challenge to it anymore, a case of beer is heavier!(Aww man, NOW we're corrupting the MINDS of children!) Can't win for losin', can we???

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Tue, Dec 14, 2010, at 5:38 PM

  • Donk, Before my time the old house had a back porch that was boxed in for a bedroom for my two older brothers. They had traded with a cousin some marbles for a pet 'coon and didn't want him to get away the first night.

    They put a collar on him and secured him so he could stay the night on the foot of the bed.

    They forgot about the old tom cat that came in the window each morning and landed on the bed through out the summer season.

    Well, there was a case for cat abuse, 'coon abuse, and boys abuse when the cat jumped in and landed on the 'coon!

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 12:05 AM

  • Old John, I'm still laughing about your 'coon story, having had a "pet" coon.

    That soon was thed world's smartest thief and con guy. How the hell he ever convinced the old man to let him ride in the car upon the back of the front seat. He and the coon woujod head into town where everyone who saw they was sure the old man had finally lost his mind. He and the coon would stop for an ice cream cone. All reports were the coon thoroughly enjoyed his treat.

    After all the misadventures with "Butch", I prefer dogs.

    -- Posted by voyager on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 12:38 AM

  • Voyager, When I was age 4 I think somehow my big sisters convinced the old man to let them go trick or treating. When they came home I dove into their treat bag and unwrapped a small white candy and gobbled it down before I realized it did not taste like candy. I got sick, regurgitated in the middle of the living room floor and my sisters had a lot of splaing to do about why they had a hotel sized bar of soap in their treat bag!

    Everything works out in the long run, those sisters just recently introduced me to husbands and children!. :):) Can't hold a grudge forever you know.

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 1:02 AM

  • Old John,

    Did you get your computer problem resolved?

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 1:05 AM

  • Wheels, I went in safe mode to recovery an found an option that said restore to previous. There was a microsoft automatic update about the same time of the problem. I clicked restore to before and it works ok now.

    Thanks for your input. I got to looking for what you mentioned and found stuff related that guided me to the fix!

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 1:13 AM

  • Wheels, Just thinking, did you ever throw one of those great big nichol Baby Ruth bars into the Greenbriar swimming hole and yell turd alert?

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 1:23 AM

  • Old John,

    Glad you got the problem taken care of.

    I had a problem with an update that caused some kind of problem a few weeks back. Now I have forgotten what it was... but not what you experienced.

    Noooooo, I did not throw any big Baby Ruths in the swimming hole. If I got a nickel together to buy a candy bar, you can make book on it, I ate it.

    Anyway never made it to the Greenbriar swimming hole, we used Malone's Creek, Dry Creek, and mostly the Diversion Channel by the old Hy 91 Bridge. It was a fine place to freshen up after you bucked hay bales until after dark. I guess no one ever thought about or worried about snakes.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 1:38 AM

  • Holey smokes, listening to you guys I'm beginning to understand how many adventures and misadventures I missed in my younger days. Of course, when I got older it didn't matter anyway.

    -- Posted by voyager on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 9:38 AM

  • Does a fella GOOD to let his mind "idle at rest" once in a while, and remember even the rotten, evil-things he did when younger.(Maybe even as long as ONE-year ago!☺) Hell, even VOYAGER-here is "lettin' his hair down", or combin' it over, whatever applies!

    OK, that WAS a cheap-shot, but waddya' expect from a bunch of old-"kids"....!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 10:19 AM

  • donknome, what hair?

    -- Posted by voyager on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 11:57 AM

  • VOYAGER: Well, I just took a long-shot guess, since I have no idea of your actual appearance!☺ You MAY have a head-full of hair that rivals ol' Fabio, for all I know! But, even IF you're bald as a cue-ball---you know what they say causes that condition, don't 'cha? Somethin' to do with a head-board of a bed, and...???!

    Kinda like the fella with BIG-feet---you KNOW what they say about HIM, right???

    Yeah, that's right: He's CLUMSY! And according to what ah heered on the playground, ah just figger'd all those kinds of men must own a meat-packing plant as well, since I understood that they wuz hangin' a lot of meat?

    (I never was the "brightest-bulb in the line", anyways! But since LED's have come about, I don't need as much "juice" to shine-bright, now. I'm almost considered college-edgeyoukated nowadays enny-who, with mah High-School Diploma of the late-'60's...!☺)

    Cain't buy horse-sense, with dollars-n'-cents: It has to be (L)EARNED, over a period of time.

    Like I need to tell you other "kids" this, already...!!!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 3:06 PM

  • On the subject of hair, half gone by force of nature and time, the other half gone by action of she who was Not obeyed and the inability to run fast enough or duck as quickly as before.

    -- Posted by voyager on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 5:52 PM

  • Voyager, No real hair loss here, it just slid down and shows itself in different places, like ears, nose and eyebrows.

    And how come some old guys have a two day old beard no matter what day it is?

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 6:10 PM

  • That, Old John, is one of the puzzlements of the ages. We retain hair where we either do not want or need it and not where we do.

    -- Posted by voyager on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 6:18 PM

  • Wheels, I saw a TV report about the popular toys this Christmas.

    Never took that much to entertain me.

    I had a little balsa airplane [probably came in a box of oats] that had a propeller driven by a rubber band. That thing would almost get off the ground if a good rubber band was wound tight, but it zoomed pretty good if launched in the air.

    Any neat toys in your past?

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 6:48 PM

  • Oh no, he DIDN'T!!!

    (sigh!) Yes, he DID!!! OLD JOHN went an' started the subject of REAL-toys, now, didn't he?

    Naw, I won't "skunk"-it all up for y'all yet---I'll give you guys "first-blood" on it!

    (This thread is almost as much fun as my first FULL-can of "Dad-Approved", A&P Tudor-brand beer....☺☺☺!)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Wed, Dec 15, 2010, at 7:11 PM

  • Old John,

    I remember those airplanes.

    But my favorite toy was the windup catepillar (everything was a caterpillar that had tracks on it) dozer that had a big spring in it like a clock that had to be wound up with a key sticking out the side of it. It had rubber tracks and a blade on the front as I remember it. There was many a happy hour playing in the dirt with that thing. I did more imaginary dirt moving with that one toy than they did when they built the diverson channel and related ditches to drain Souteast Missouri.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 12:01 AM

  • Have_Wheels wrote:

    "I did more imaginary dirt moving with that one toy than they did when they built the diverson channel and related ditches to drain Souteast Missouri."

    We had Tonka Toys and ERTL John Deere Tractors and implements. We moved real dirt. Those metal tractors had metal disks and plows and you could really dig a furrow or disk up a piece of ground. They had blades that raised and lowered, clamshells that opened and shut, and you could really move some earth, about a pound at a time.

    Back in those days, John Deere practically gave the tractors away as advertisement. If your parents or, in our case, grandparents, bought a new tractor or piece of equipment, they'd give them an armful of tractors and equipment to 'take home to the kids'.

    All the kids in the neighborhood brought theirs to our house, because we had a huge side yard and our parents didn't mind it being dug up (it was a baseball field in the Summer, football field in the Winter, a bicycle racecourse, golf course, 'kick the can' playing field, and of course a farm or construction site in between. We even flooded it with the garden hose and made a hockey rink of it one Winter (but we got a 'whoopin' for that, I believe).

    The Tonkas were expensive, but they lasted forever. One friend had an Earth Mover we nicknamed 'Two-Ton', because of its weight, that his father played with when he was a child.

    Of course, those toys had enough unguarded pinch points and sharp edges that OSHA would have shut our side yard down, if they ever came around. Fortunately for us, our project was small enough to slip beneath the radar (not to mention that OSHA didn't come into being until 1970, by which time we were already moving on to other things.)

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 7:56 AM

  • One Christmas an Aunt(-in-Law) sent a toy submarine wrapped up badly and hurriedly in a piece of previous year's recycled Christmas paper. It required a bicycle air pump, not included, to fill it with air (why I never figured out and never got it to work.) Best I could figure somehow the air made the thing sail. If so the needed parts were missing. It ended up in the bottom of the Capaha Park lagoon and good riddance.

    Years later after the Aunt's death, I was visiting her grandchildren and related the story to them. They looked at me and just smiled knowingly. Finally, one said she was not surprised. Similar things had happened to all of them. The aunt would go to rummage sales and buy the cheapest thing she could find. She would wrap them up in wrapping paper saved from several years past, the packages always looking like a bag of wool tied up badly.

    For this I was forced as a kid to write a lying thank you letter. That took a great deal of creativity.

    Once she even commented what "lovely" and thoughful letters I wrote. It required a great deal of personal discipline to keep me from gagging.

    -- Posted by voyager on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 10:17 AM

  • These are ALL-great!(I just realized I was sittin' here twisting in this pivot-chair like a little-boy while you all went on!)

    I was more in SHAPLEY's-league, with the tractor/implement combo in the spring/summer dirt-piles, and the grader/dozer/dump-trucks on my "highway" in the winter. (I patched holes in the top of a retaining-wall with mud, in the fall. That was my main-highway! I was a seasonal-"worker", so to speak!)

    I feel for ya', RICK, in that I realize how fortunate I was, in this matter. It wasn't all "bows-n'-ribbons" for ME, either. Many a time I "custom-designed" more than one-"toy".(Now, I say "toy" with the "'s, because it got even MORE-inventive the older I got. The "toys" got bigger, an' more entertaining(for any onlookers!)the older I got!

    But, looking back NOW, RICK: In all honesty, IF you had the chance to go back in time and change things---would you? I mean, looking at it from TODAYS'-p.o.v., and how good it felt once you worked your way to the point where you didn't HAVE-TO improvise your "toys" anymore? I know it felt GREAT, to me! Therefore, I'm just not sure I'd wanna change one thing, as far as enjoyment was concerned.

    (Maybe NEXT-up, we can tell about some of the more dangerous---but FUN!---"toys" we made!)

    Almost as chilling as wearing randomly-exploding underwear to school!

    NO, I did NOT---but, I mean, in the "SPIRIT-of" wearing such! A-A-W-W-W, it's kinda complex! You'll see!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 11:10 AM

  • You didn't get any toys with a new team of mules!

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 11:20 AM

  • At a friends house, we used our creativity to build a road and fence in a place for those miniture animals and toy soliers he had. The big problem encountered was when his father discovered we used his welding rods for telephone poles and some of his new nails for fence posts.

    A younger cousin had one of those rubber tracked wind up vehicles without the blade. Since the tracks were tall, that thing would climb over grandmas high top work boots and keep going until it hit the wall, climbed up and turned over to return to where it came before the spring wound down. I think it was called a Mighty Mike or Mighty Mac.

    -- Posted by Old John on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 11:37 AM

  • One of mt mothers favorite expressions ws it's not what you want, but what you get that makes you fat

    -- Posted by mitziesmomma on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 12:18 PM

  • You must not have had to ride on a makeshift seat on the tongue of a cultivator behind two mules. Mules are a gift that keeps on giving.

    -- Posted by SpankTheTank on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 1:13 PM

    Try that same stint without the makeshift seat Spank. Not a lot, but I did get to do it. Wonder what it would have been like to fall off that cultivator tongue and wind up plowed under. Somebody mentioned OSHA a few posts back. Even if we had OSHA at the time, we could have not paid the fine... so I presume they would have just moved on to greener pastures.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 1:48 PM

  • I remember some of those little light wieght metal toys that were tab and slot construction.

    You could easily bend the tabs to open them up and read part of a beer can label.

    Back when inner tubes were made with live rubber, slingshots worked a lot bettter.

    -- Posted by Old John on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 1:54 PM

  • We used to ride on a plank of wood that served as a catwalk behind the planter. Our job was to watch the little drive chains on the six planter hoppers and shout our lungs out so the tractor driver could hear us over the noise of the tractor engine whenever a chain came loose.

    There was a pipe handrail to hold on to. you could walk back and forth across the board to look at all the chains. We usually did this for about ten hours a day, with a break everytime the hoppers had to be filled (about every 30-40 minutes, if my memory serves me well).

    Some of the planters owned by other farmers had hard metal seats instead of the plank, but I think having the ability to walk around, stretch, and sit when you wanted was preferable to having a fixed spot to sit all day. I did see at least one seat that had a foam rubber cushion glued to it, but that was a rare luxury. However, you could always take your shirt or a jacket and make a cushion, if you were so inclined.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 1:56 PM

  • Shapley,

    It is obvious that you were a thoroughly modern lad. I remember a year when the weather was wet and it was getting late, so the fields didn'tget the normal amount of disking and harrowing.

    Try hoofing it along behind a mule drawn, two row, green John Deere corn planter all day when you were about 6 or 7. The job was to make sure all of the corn was covered. If it was not, cover it and catch up.

    After about 2 weeks of that I was so glad to see it rain and we could not work. My Grandfather came by and rewarded me for my work.... folding money, a whole dollar. Made it all worth it as I remember it.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 2:09 PM

  • Yeah, that's me, a thoroughly modern guy! :)

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 2:12 PM

  • And somethun else Shapley. I distinctly remember you saying somthing about growing up in the bootheel.

    So it is fairly obvious that you did not have to walk three miles to and from school... up hill both ways, like we did in Bollinger County. ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 2:17 PM

  • We had Billy Goat Hill, which rose a majestic eight feet above the surrounding landscape. It's since been renamed, I think, to Angora Heights or some such, to make it appear more 'upscale', but it'll always be 'Billy Goat Hill' to most of us.

    I did used to walk to school, or ride my bike, in Grade School (Catholic School) there was no bus. There were no hills though. Levees and overpasses were the only 'high ground' aside from the aforementioned hill, and I didn't have to cross any of them on the way to school.

    We did go to school in the snow, though. We Catholics even had to go when the public school was out. I don't remember it ever being 'waist deep', though.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 2:35 PM

  • Being one of those Mackeral Snappers myself Shapley, I know what you mean about going to school whatever the weather. Our school was Public but the kids were 99.9% Catholic and so was the school board and they didn't want to go through calculating makup days. It was just a lot simpler to get your young rear ends out there and go to school as scheduled.

    In another billion years or so, those hills where I grew up may erode down to being only 8 feet high, but then again maybe not, too many rocks. If they do, I think I may move back.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 2:48 PM

  • I forgot to mention the Indian Mounds. Levees, overpasses, and Indian Mounds were the highest ground around.

    But I didn't have to cross any Indian Mounds on the way to school, either.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 2:53 PM

  • According to a former co-worker that was in China during the war, the Chinese used to sell the fecal matter for fertilizer. It wasn't worth much, being so much available, but it did have some cash value.

    According to my former co-worker, he was walking through a marketplace and stopped to buy some vegetables. The woman pulled a beet out of the box, and there was fecal matter still on it. He claimed never to have eaten a beet since that day.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 3:00 PM

  • The boy up the street who lived with his grandpaprents always had the tallest tree and the largest pile of presents under it. He got everything including Lionel tran, Gilbert Chemistry set and stuff beyond counting. Yet he seemed the saddest person I knew. Strangely, I was never jealous of him. Instead I felt sorry for him although I would never let him know. It was like he lived in some sort of sterile vacuum.

    Years later I mentioned this to some of the kids who lived the the neighborhood. Many of them replied they had also felt the same way at the time.

    -- Posted by voyager on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 4:22 PM

  • I had a Lionel train, 'O' Guage, that my parents bought at a moving sale for $8. There was a very large amount of track, a heavy diesel engine, and many, many freight cars. I still have most of it, one of the few toys that survived my childhood, even though the engine is long gone.

    There was a loose wire on the engine. I had a woodburning set, and we would use it to solder the wire back whenever it broke loose. We didn't have any solder, so we just re-heated the little dab that was already on the wire. That's why it kept coming loose, of course, but we couldn't see the logic of buying a whole spool of solder for that one little project, when it was so simple to re-solder it whenever it came loose.

    A friend offered to take the engine and get it 'fixed right' for me. That was the last I saw of it. I was going to buy a new one to replace it. Imagine my shock when I found out the same engine cost $275. Needless to say, my collection is now sans engine.

    I also had a chemistry set. Seems like nearly every kid in the neighborhood got one that same year, so there must have been a sale on them, or a good advertisement that persuaded all of us to ask for one at the same time, I don't recall. I remember that it was in a metal box, sort of like a first-aid kit (which might not have been coincidental). There were test tubes and flasks and a Bunsen Burner, although I don't remember what we used for fuel for the Bunsen Burner. There were bottles of chemicals, naturally. There was also a Chemistry book, but I doubt any of us ever bothered with it much. We just started dumping chemicals together, as I recall.

    I must have read some of the instructions, though, because I remember growing salt crystals in a Petri dish, which I took to school as an extra-credit project.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 4:47 PM

  • Spank,

    Down in the Bootheel, six-row planters were the cheap ones Rich farmers had eight-row and twelve-row ones. I remember seeing a twelve-row planter going down the road one time. They had their own frame they could be turned sideways and carried on so you could get them on the road.

    The six-rown planters fit on the three-point hitch, so you had to go down the road with that extra-wide piece of equipment sticking out there. I was never qualified to drive the planter tractor, but I did pull a disc and run a cultivator (which was pronounced cull a vader. You were looked down on if you enunciated the letter 't').

    I once got my cultivator hung on a guard rail along the levee road. The cultivator mechanism was spring-mounted, so when I ran against the guardrail, they just rode up over it and then dropped down on the backside. Of course, it was more than my feeble muscles could muster to lift it back over the thing. I searched the toolbox on the tractor and found a rusty ratchet and socket. Oddly, it didn't fit a single bolt on the tractor that I could find, but it fit the bolts that held the guardrail on...

    My grandfather arrived after I had loosened two of the bolts, and spared me from removing the rest. he gathered up some logs, had me back the tractor up a bit and put the logs under the tyre. As I pulled forward, the tractor rode up on the logs, lifting the cultivator high enough to clear the guardrail.

    I can't remember if I ever tightened those nuts back on the rail...

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 4:57 PM

  • The technology of farm equipment as I remember was slow to progress. Folks in the '60s were still using a lot of tractors designed in the '30s. They did spiff up what was out there with a lot of add ons and enhancements in the early '50s.

    My cousin convinced his dad to switch to 6 row equipment. Soon after, 8 row was the thing.

    We stuck with 4 row.

    My dad had a natural talent concerning anything mechanical and we ended up with a Farmall M that would out do a modern I-H 560. The two point pick up hitch was the big thing at the end of his farming days.

    Long hours with a weed hook in the bean field meant that B B gun I finally got was no challenge.

    What's more macho at age 6 than stopping a B B with a calussed hand?

    Fast forward a few years and the Etch A Sketch, a Japenese transister radio, and telescope were great toys.

    -- Posted by Old John on Thu, Dec 16, 2010, at 10:57 PM

  • And I grew up thinking books were the greatest thing since sliced bread, and the public library was finding the Motherlode. Some things were not learned from books, however.

    -- Posted by voyager on Fri, Dec 17, 2010, at 7:08 AM

  • Up here in the hills, the narrower equipment makes more sense. Down in the flatlands of the delta region, twelve-row is convenient and sensible.

    I'm not sure what the rule is on planting. I seem to recall that you plant root-crops by the dark of the Moon and above-ground crops by the light of the Moon, but I could be mistaken. That was a luxury we never had. You started planting your row crops when the Mississippi receded enough to allow you to get in there and you started planting 12 to 14 hours a day until you had it all planted. Some years we were planting up until the 4th of July, and even after once, as I recall. I don't think we ever stopped planting because of the phase of the Moon.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Dec 17, 2010, at 8:06 AM

  • Up here in the hills, the narrower equipment makes more sense. Down in the flatlands of the delta region, twelve-row is convenient and sensible.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Dec 17, 2010, at 8:06 AM

    Far back in the corner of my Grandfather's old machine shed, I remember seeing an old one row, horse drawn corn planter setting. Never saw it used though.

    Some of the fields I have seen, only the two outside rows would have been planted with a 12 row planter. ☺ ☺

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Fri, Dec 17, 2010, at 11:06 AM

  • Wheels, I may have told this before; My father in law told that when plowing the big field, they were required to keep an axe tied to the plow to chop brush at the end of the rows while the horses or mules rested.

    I saw on RFDTV a no till setup made in the early '50s. It was mounted to a Farmall MTA? the tractor that became the 300, 350, etc.

    TA was torque amplifier.

    Dad traded for a 300 that needed paint and had me drive it to Lutesville to the dealership for new paint. In the field, pulling back on the TA stick slowed the tractor and gave it more pulling power. So when I started down the steep hill starting at where Peters Supply I pulled back on that stick. The tractor speeded up and I stood on the brakes with all the 10 year old weight I had. That made a tremendous squeal and the tractor continued to go faster as the 90 degree turn at the bottem of the hill approached.

    That's when by guarian angel or dumb luck intervened and I did what was not supposed to be possible. I squeezed and released the TA latch on top of the handle and shifted from 5th to 4th. Blue smoke came out the exaust to enhance the death rattle of an over wound engine and I made that curve on all three.

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Dec 17, 2010, at 8:33 PM

  • Old John,

    Never had to chop brush while the mules rested. I needed the rest as bad as they did I figure.

    Not familar with that model of tractor, but am very familiar with that hill. Had that shift not worked we may not be carrying on this conversation. You could have very well flipped it had you tried making the turn and wound up with the MTA sitting on your belly.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 12:05 AM

  • I wish I had seen this thread earlier, I worked New Madrid County for quite a few years and actually know where Billy Goat Hill is.

    We grew up farming with Ford "red bellies". As a youngster we had just stopped using mules when I was old enough to hit the fields though we still raised them to sell.

    -- Posted by Red_Rhino on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 7:18 AM

  • Red,

    My Dad and my Uncles worked together a lot. The first mechanized equipment we had was a little Ford Ferguson. After that came the red bellies. Took a while though before we gave up on the mules, had to make sure that new fangled stuff would work out.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 8:49 AM

  • Red,

    Billy Goat Hill appears to be legendary. Was it really so steep that Shapley had to walk around it to get to school?

    :-) :-)

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 8:55 AM

  • Have_Wheels_Will_Travel,

    I remember those old gray Fergusons, Fordson, Ford Ferguson and the ongoing variations. I remember the first tractor my dad bought without a hand crank backup caused quite a bit of consternation.

    Well, I don't want to snitch Shapley out, but the definition of a "hill" by a native New Madridian and an outsider is a bit different.

    I think I may have worked with some of Shapley's relatives.

    -- Posted by Red_Rhino on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 9:21 AM

  • I remember the Farmall with no 3-point, same with the old Johnny Popper. A lot of our equipment was modified mule drawn stuff for a while.

    I remember the thumb and hand crank, also keep thumbs on the outside of the steering wheel.

    -- Posted by Red_Rhino on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 10:06 AM

  • Warm weather starting instructions for a properly tuned M Farmal: Apply choke, position crank at 6 o'clock, raise crank to 9 o'clock, release choke and turn on ignition and quickly raise crank to 12 o'clock.

    Believe it or not, most times this worked.

    One thing I had to learn was the signals used on the farm. Certian hand motions meant raise or lower, faster or slower on shut down immediatly to hear verbal detail of my err.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 10:35 AM

  • shut down immediatly to hear verbal detail of my err.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 10:35 AM

    Was that signal the one where your Dad put his hat on the ground overhanded and then stomped on it.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 10:39 AM

  • also keep thumbs on the outside of the steering wheel.

    -- Posted by Red_Rhino on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 10:06 AM

    Learned that one young. All I can say is thanks to whoever inventing electric start and power steering.

    -- Posted by We Regret To Inform U on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 11:02 AM

  • Wheels, That was the signal that he was thinking about stomping somewhere else. :)

    One summer in the back of the field I overheard one misquito say to the other "Shall we eat him here or take him with us", the other replied "We need to get him out of here fast before the big boys take'm away from us!".

    Of course I could have imagined that. Dad liked the sound of cackle from a perfectly tuned engine so the "M"s didn't have mufflers. Around 6:30 pm that exhaust blowing into my face started to smell just like homemade lightbread, salt pork, white beans, green beans, tomatoes, potatoes and corn on the cob!

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 11:11 AM

  • -- Posted by We Regret To Inform U on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 11:02 AM

    Ain't it the truth, we still have a couple of those old tractors, but now I use cab models with all the amenities; makes the day go so much better.

    -- Posted by Red_Rhino on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 11:11 AM

  • Regret, If I recall correctly what I've read, you can say thanks to a guy named Cadillac for the electic cranking motor.

    The early Ford tractors out did the competition by having the implement lift system integral with the tractor. Like so many of Henry Ford's innovations, the three point hitch was a refined and retuned invention of someone else and the design was patented by Ford.

    Ferguson started the rivalry by one upping Ford with a patented "Draft control" system that made his tractor more desirable for plowing. Ford agreed to purchase or pay royalties to incorporate the Ferguson System with his 3 point hitch. A metal "Ferugson System" badge appeared on early production models. The patent ran out before lawsuit concerning patent rights could be settled.

    I have read that when Ferguson died they found not yet patented designs almost identical to the John Deere powershift transmission suggesting his genius was pirated once more.

    This is all from memory of some reading several years ago. Red Rhino can probably correct me if I got it wrong.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 11:45 AM

  • Old John

    I really like all those old tractors and yes Ford and Ferguson had an on again off again relationship with Ferguson. Ford had actually gotten out of the tractor business until the Ferguson patent. Ferguson demonstrated it at Ford's farm and Ford started production again incorporating Ferguson's patent.

    I remember tractors branded Ferguson, Ford-Ferguson and so on. There use to be a lot of tractor manufacturers, I personally remember the Oliver, Minneapolis Moline, Massey Harris, IH, Allis Chalmers and so on. Now even though some names remain, much of the production is all under one umbrella company like AGCO or CNH.

    -- Posted by Red_Rhino on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 12:24 PM

  • Really enjoyed all of this! Thanks Rick ... thanks all of you ...

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 4:33 PM

  • Ah, THERE'S "GURU" and "RHINO"! About gave-up on you! Yeah, guess we've(well, I'VE!) "imposed" enough upon RICK'S-original thread---time to start-anew, I suppose.

    But just LOOK at this! I mean, we ALL had fun, and in ONE-HUNDRED FIFTY-FIVE postings---it STAYED fun, and WITHOUT the damned-political banter, that gives us all headaches!

    Maybe again sometime, eh...???☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 10:17 PM

  • Donknome-2,

    Shoot we ain't near done BS'n one another yet.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 10:33 PM

  • Yeah, I know. But it's gettin' closer to "The Holiday" each day now, an' it's about time to go into one of my growly, teed-off,"you stink more than I do!"-moods! An' I don't want it to boil-over onto here, an' ruin it all!

    I hate holidays. Just when you need family the worst---and the few-survivors are busily distancing themselves from you, because you're "just not the same", as you were ten-years' ago.

    Thank God my wife still stands with me, though. She's the "Jesus-nut" of my life, anymore!

    (How many of you know what a "Jesus-nut" is? I'll give a hint to anyone who doesn't: If you're an atheist, an' it comes loose---you'll be converted before you hit the ground, or else...!)

    Sorry! I just couldn't STAND goin' out, without a final parting-shot...!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 11:02 PM

  • I had and uncle that said if man can dream it, someday he will do it.

    In the late 50's I remember predictions that somewhere in the future, farmers would till and harvest from behind an office desk. A system of tracks at each end of the field with a cable rigging would pull implements through the field via a programable command card.

    With today's GPS technology that is possible without the tracks and cables.

    Of course Dad touched on a like self guidence system he had in his early days. When he was unable to steer himself home after the party, the horse did the driving back home without any need of electronic gadgetry.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 11:06 PM

  • I have a Big Four John Deere sycle mower. Someone told me one of those would wear a team out real fast because they were so heavy. It was also customary to tie up your dog/s when it was in use since dogs need legs.

    Dad made a concrete mixer out of what we called a lead barrel. It was keg shaped and real heavy but I think it was steel with the ends leaded in. My oldest brother said he worked a week after school with a hammer and chisel to remove the top.

    I have a barrel just like it in tact and it is stamped "Standard Oil 1904" We also had a couple of those barrels to collect rain water. Mom used the rain water to wash her hair.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Dec 18, 2010, at 11:38 PM

  • Love the 'memories' and interesting stories on the thread!

    Noticed some mentioning getting a clue as to the age of posters from their stories. Therefore, I decided not to include any of my memories ... ~grinning~ Anyway, with a Shrug, 3 Afghans, 3 Market Bags and 2 Prayer Shawls in crochet mode, and 1 Prayer Shawl on the knitting needles ... And Christmas in a week ... No time for story-telling. And Pops still needs his cook/dishwasher--nurse/companion, too, so ... Time Flies!

    don, I'm sort of a Bah Humbug Person this time of year ... but going with the flow is easier than ...

    Old J. ... my grandma kept a barrel for rain, too, and rinsed her hair with it. One day when I was real little, I saw hundreds of little things swimming frantically around in it. The next time I went to her house, they were gone ... I thought it was icky to wash her hair with THINGS in the water ... Assumed years later that they were tadpoles, and hopefully matured into frogs and left before her next shampoo.

    Enjoy you all so very much!

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 3:42 AM

  • Merry Christmas Mom!!!

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 9:24 AM

  • Gurusmom, During a visit by a naugty younger cousin, I happened to hear a weak yeowl coming from the side of the smoke house. Apparently cous was amusing himself by watching Tom the cat swim round and round in the barrel and became disengaged in diligent duty by the bully rooster.

    Old Tom the cat was happy to see me I think, but I didn't see him again until a week after cous left!

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 1:02 PM

  • Nothing much uglier than a wet cat, is there? Or more furious when one tried to rescue it!

    I bathed one ... once. Fortunately, it usually only takes me one time to learn a lesson ...

    Thank you, Wheels ... have a super Christmas before your south-bound adventures.

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 3:41 PM

  • my grandma kept a barrel for rain, too, and rinsed her hair with it.

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 3:42 AM

    My great grandmother kept old lard cans under her drains and would do the same thing. It must have been good because she had a pony tail below her waist until she passed at 95.

    -- Posted by We Regret To Inform U on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 4:29 PM

  • Thanks for the "support", WHEELS, GURUSMOM, OLD JOHN, VOYAGER, and of course, RICK, who started it all! With your encouragement, I think I just might be able to stomach this festive-season, after all! Of course there are others not mentioned. No slight intended, by any means! It's just that I've been bantering with these five "outlaws-by-association" from the get-go! Don't need a bitter-family, when you have FRIENDS instead---even if they DON'T-know you personally!(Which is undoubtedly WHY they "talk" with me!☺) So MERRY CHRISTMAS/HAPPY NEW YEAR to you ALL!!!

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    BUT---we STILL have a chance for one-last go at "youthful-abandon", if interested? Just like that song,"Old Outlaws Like Us"(Jennings/Nelson/Williams Jr./Tritt?)---here's how we could get our "15-minutes of fame", that we're all supposed to get at least ONCE in a lifetime.

    I count at least SIX of us. So, here's what I propose: A blitz-like "raid", on the cities of Jackson and Cape!!! I know where there's an old flatbed truck, with ONE headlight, NO mufflers, and only TWO of the SIX-tailights work---that'll get their attention, FAST!

    Now, we'll start-off in Jackson, where they hate LOUD-EXHAUSTS, CIVIL-UNREST, and VEHICLES ON MAIN-STREET AFTER THE SUN GOES DOWN. And, since it's MY-truck, I'll drive, smoke cigars, cuss, and throw-out beer cans, which you other-five will have been so kind as to empty for me before you pass them forward.(Remember, be safe: Do Not Drink & Drive!) We'll bully Jackson PD into a low-speed, OJ-style-pursuit, from Starlight-to-Center Junction.

    At that point, Cape PD should take over, as we continue our trek along Kingshighway to Broadway. By then, they should have the spike-strips deployed, which means PLENTY of sparks by the time we get in-range of the KFVS-TowerCam. We can slide-on down to B-way & Main, hang a right(is it still ONE-way, or is it TWO, now?), and head for that freakin' CLOCK, at Main and---is it Themis? And THAT would be the "end of the line", for the final-ride of "Old-Outlaws-Like-Us"!!!

    Just THINK how famous we'd be! How those cute-little gals at KFVS would be swarming all-around us, asking: "And when did you first start your life of crime, and why end it here?"

    Gee, maybe SEMO will even name their next FOUNTAIN in our honor.....!!!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 7:34 PM

  • Civil disobedience, donknome-2, Hot Dang! Just my thing! This might be a good New Year's Eve stunt! I don't think the local gardarmes would look upon this adventure with much pleasure

    -- Posted by voyager on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 10:15 PM

  • Donknome-2

    You keep hanging in there sunshine. As interesting as your police chase escapade sounds, you simply got to hold off until warmer weather. I don't protest well when I am freezing my behind off.

    Be happy to help empty the beer cans, but I could hold up my end better if it were 90 degrees instead of 9 degrees.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 10:19 PM

  • This might be a good New Year's Eve stunt!

    -- Posted by voyager on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 10:15 PM

    Voyager, this is the midwest, not the equater. You have any idea how cold it could be. I don't own enough clothes to do that on New Years Eve.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Dec 19, 2010, at 10:23 PM

  • Donk, If it wasn't so cold, I would suggest we all get together and charter a plane and toss out a bunch of cats over Cape and Jackson at 10,000 feet then jump out after them with our parachutes on and see who could catch the most cats before they landed. No harm would come to the cats because everyone knows they land on their feet anyway. We could notify the local media of the great catcall windfall coming from above and tell them Santa Clause was sponsoring the event.[Voyager could make a convincing St. Nich with the right wiskers and cap]

    With a promise of catastrophy and curiosity the news media would scratch and claw to paw all over us for interviews and our lives would be litterally in nine kinds of tell.

    ok that idea came from Neal Boortz

    -- Posted by Old John on Mon, Dec 20, 2010, at 1:34 AM

  • Aww, c'mon guys! It's a five-tonner, with a steel-bed, an' four-foot sides---an' I'll even leave the dump-gate on, so's we can build a bonfire in there, to stay warm!☺

    An' I guaran-dang-tee you, THAT would make the 10 o'clock news---if only for 15-seconds!---as we slam-into the clock, drunken and ablaze!

    Talk about a "to-do", for a bucket-list...!!!☺!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Mon, Dec 20, 2010, at 8:49 AM

  • Old John wrote:

    "No harm would come to the cats because everyone knows they land on their feet anyway."

    I seem to recall that one of my college dorm-mates experimented with that in the Towers halls. He reported that cats do, in fact, land on their feet most of the time, but from four floor or higher, it doesn't matter much...

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Mon, Dec 20, 2010, at 8:57 AM

  • Regarding cats landing on their feet... when I was still in grade school, I remember an older boy discussing that very thing. He said they won't land on their feet, if you put them down over handed. Don't really remember if one bit him or what but it seemed to upset him and he responded.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Dec 20, 2010, at 9:50 AM

  • Wheels, sometimes my enthusiasm for a project gets the better of my reason. But a New Year's tiddle de winks party just doesn't seem to get it in my active wicked little head.

    Furthermore, I positively refuse point blank to EVER never put on a Santie Claus costume. Its more fun playing the Grinch!

    -- Posted by voyager on Mon, Dec 20, 2010, at 9:53 AM

  • Voyager, What kind of toys were popular in your Santa Clause days?

    It was much past my Santa Clause days but the most memorable toys to me was a Japanese transistor radio, a cheap telescope and an Etch-a-sketch.

    My nephew got a train set a few years later that expanded until it took up most of the room in the basement. A good investment maybe because he went on to the real thing and a rewarding career.

    -- Posted by Old John on Tue, Dec 21, 2010, at 9:15 PM

  • Old John, outside of the obligatory baseball glover which I got and didn't want and the basketball which I didn't get but did want? Well I got a sled which I promptly slid down Dunklin hill and tried to knock a coal truck off Westend Blvd. (Coal truck won and I got six weeks in the hospital with broken leg and arm.)

    I think my Mother was a bit apprehensive about any Christmas present because she suspected I would surely find a way to do bodily injury. She was right. I managed to run my new bicycle into a culvert crumpling the tire rim and breaking the yoke. Ever do a flip over the handlebars from an abrupt stop?

    So, Old John, my memory of Christmas presents of my younger days is somewhat checkered.

    -- Posted by voyager on Tue, Dec 21, 2010, at 10:15 PM

  • The springs winds from the south that were calm in the morning and strong in afternoon promted me to ride the bicycle to school. I could almost coast home.

    One day with the wind to my back I cranked the pedals to pass a tractor running full bore and pulling a wagonfull of grain. That was just as I passed the house of the little dog from hell that always tried to chew my ankles. The dog was so exited he overran my ankles and ended up under the front wheel of the bike just as I was in front of the tractor.

    The back fender hit the boy just about the time the boy hit the pavement! The tractor followed with a near miss.

    It took a while for all that to heal.

    -- Posted by Old John on Tue, Dec 21, 2010, at 11:24 PM

  • Darn, I don't like beer, don ... Well, unless it's Negra Modelo. And ... and ... I've never been in jail, so probably prefer not to at this stage of my life. Although ... have been fingerprinted once ... A silly, stupid reason for that ... May have told that to Wheels once, in a Weak Moment?

    Always thought jumping out of a plane would be an exciting thing to do, so maybe Old J.'s idea suits me better?

    Ummmm ... as has been mentioned, though ... It's WINTER out there, and & hate cold worse than most anything in the world! BTW, Old J. ... I always wanted a train set, and would have done the same thing your nephew did ... build on it until it took up a whole room.

    Rick, you're a treasure!

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 3:13 AM

  • This is fun!

    I'll bet a lot of you have heard the expression, "cold enough to freeze the balls of a brass monkey".

    Apparently, in the days of sailing ships, cannon balls were stacked on the decks in an egg-crate type device called a "monkey" in sailor-jargon. Brass was used because the iron cannon balls would rust to a monkey made of iron in the damp and salty sea air. Brass tends to expand and contract with changes in temperature. During winter excursions in the icy north Atlantic, it would often get so cold that the monkey would contract so much that the cannon balls would not stay in their assigned slots in the monkey, and they would roll off onto the deck. Thus, the phrase, "it's cold enough outside to freeze the (cannon) balls off the brass monkeys."

    Merry Christmas! Happy New Year!

    -- Posted by Little_Mac on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 7:48 AM

  • Mom,

    Would the fingerprinting have had anything to do with a creek?

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 7:51 AM

  • http://www.snopes.com/language/stories/brass.asp

    -- Posted by Acronym on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:03 AM

  • Acronym;

    Well, I'll be darned! I heard this story way back in high school in the 70's...never would have thought it was inaccurate. Just goes to show - always check your facts before you open your mouth, eh?

    -- Posted by Little_Mac on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:31 AM

  • Never let a little truth stand in the way of a good story!

    -- Posted by voyager on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:40 AM

  • According to Wikipedia:

    "Early references to "brass monkeys" in the 19th century have no references to balls at all, but instead variously say that it is cold enough to freeze the tail, nose, ears, and whiskers off a brass monkey; or hot enough to "scald the throat" or "singe the hair" of a brass monkey. All of these variations imply that an actual monkey is the subject of the metaphor.

    The first recorded use of the phrase "brass monkey" appears in the humorous essay "On Enjoying Life" by Eldridge Gerry Paige (writing under the pseudonym "Dow, Jr."), published in the Sunday Mercury (New York) and republished in the book _Short Patent Sermons by Dow, Jr._ (New York, 1845): "When you love, [...] your heart, hands, feet and flesh are as cold and senseless as the toes of a brass monkey in winter.

    The second published instance of the phrase appeared in 1847, in a portion of Herman Melville's autobiographical narrative _Omoo_:

    "It was so excessively hot in this still, brooding valley, shut out from the Trades, and only open toward the leeward side of the island, that labor in the sun was out of the question. To use a hyperbolical phrase of Shorty's, 'It was 'ot enough to melt the nose h'off a brass monkey.'"

    The first recorded use of freezing a "brass monkey" dates from 1857, appearing in C.A. Abbey, _Before the Mast_, p. 108: "It would freeze the tail off a brass monkey".

    _The Story of Waitstill Baxter_, by Kate Douglas Wiggin (1913) has "The little feller, now, is smart's a whip, an' could talk the tail off a brass monkey".

    _The Ivory Trail_, by Talbot Mundy (1919) has "He has the gall of a brass monkey".

    Thomas Wolfe (1900--1938) wrote in one of his notebooks:

    "Ernest said, "It would freeze the balls off a brass monkey -- that's how cold it gets."

    ____________

    The references to brass monkeys and weather by both Melville and Abbey would seem to indicate that the expression had some nautical significance, but the Snopes article does a pretty good job of dispelling the cannonball reference. The Wikipedia provides the same data, citing Naval references as the source.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:51 AM

  • As it seems I am often "mixfused" as Rick says, it seems I am always checking things. I posted for informational purposes; very interesting thread.

    -- Posted by Acronym on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 9:20 AM

  • Acronym, I had always thought that saying pertained to Civil war cannons. I know a lot of sayings and word meanings came from that era, but it seems maybe more are rooted in naval history.

    Anyway, citing the absence of brass monkeys on front porches means cold has taken hold.

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 9:51 AM

  • Old John,

    The origins of saying are always interesting to me. I fear some may never be known and some would be deleted if discussed.

    -- Posted by Acronym on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 10:07 AM

  • Charles Earle Funk wrote a series of books on the origin of sayings.

    "A Hog on Ice" is the only one I've read, long ago (I can't even remember where he said that term came from) but he has several. They are interested reading (good stocking stuffers, too!).

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 10:11 AM

  • Thanks, I may look into that.

    -- Posted by Acronym on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 10:27 AM

  • When all the color on the newly painted steeple faded, the preacher went to the painter and demanded "Repaint thy thinner!"

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 10:49 AM

  • GURUSMOM: OK, how's about a Coke ZERO, then? I was "blowin' smoke" anyway, about the beer---my liver ain't what it used to be!☺(But, I DO still like that daily cigar, whenever possible!)

    As for jail? I guess I should invoke the Fifth, on that one, way-y-y back-there. But now that I think about it: They DID feed me, at least!

    RICK: Are you SURE it was YOUR-house, that you were pokin' around in???☺

    VOYAGER: True! But, the secret is to NEVER outright LIE---just "inflate/over-emphasize the truth"!☺

    ACRONYM: Being "mixfused" is a REQUIREMENT, on showing-up here!

    WHEELS: We just might hit 200 on here! And, "IT" still hasn't "happened"!(Never was a gambler---couldn't even win at "UNO", even if I "cheated"!) Now, "Stow-High-In-Transit" might happen, indeed! But, if "IT"-starts to happen? That'll be the signal for the coming end, for me!☺☺☺!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 10:59 AM

  • Donknome-2

    Does a bet pay extra when it reaches 200?

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 11:55 AM

  • Old_John,

    As I heard, it, the preacher had hired the painter to redo the interior of the Church. The painter, in order to make a little extra money, thinned the paint in order to stretch each gallon. As a result, the paint was pale and did not completely hide the old paint.

    The preacher told the painter to "Repaint, and thin no more!".

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 12:00 PM

  • Spank,

    Or Colder than a well driller's ***.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 12:01 PM

  • Wheels, You made me think of where I heard that first and I think you are correct. It was told on KMOX as each morning they had a riddle, pun or spoonerism for a while in the early 70's.

    I wouild listen to KMOX during the morning drive to work until I got close enough to switch to Fred on the local station.

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 12:10 PM

  • donknome-2, there is a certain well known poster on various and sundry threads whose favorite accusatiom is "You lie!" I won't mention his "name" to embarrass him further though why I should worry since he claims he never reads anything I write anyway.

    His special target is Regret.

    -- Posted by voyager on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 1:09 PM

  • OK, the 200th post. Who wins the booby prize?

    -- Posted by voyager on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 3:24 PM

  • Some things are as useless as windshield wipers on a goats ...

    So be sure you don't take any wooden nickels.

    My two cents worth?

    Is the cream of the crop still a good thing?

    Now if that ain't the berries!

    A favorite saying of a dear lady of years past: "Well I'll swan"

    "Dog gone" "work like a dog" "gone to the dogs"

    If it cost a nickel to stow high in transit, he find a way to throw it up! [a decription of the rich uncle that left us out of the will] :)

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 4:08 PM

  • I knew the well-digger. I dated his daughter for a short time. He had a donkey named Bottom. Back in the Winter of 1978-79, the Donkey fell into St. John's Bayou and drowned (or, some say it died of exposure and fell dead into the Bayou, nobody ever performed an autopsy, so it's hard to say for sure).

    Anyhow, that was the Winter that the Bayou froze solid. By the time the well-digger found his a**, it was imbedded in a solid block of ice, next to the little trickle of water that still flowed over the ice. Actually, the well-digger never found Bottom, he had to get his wife to look for it. He and both his hired hands looked all night and gave up. She went out the next morning and found Bottom in about an hour. She always had to find Bottom for him. She said he couldn't find his a** with both hands.

    We had to chip the donkey out and, when we tried to haul his a** out with a tractor, the legs just snapped clean off. We'd never seen anything as cold as the well-digger's a** that winter.

    That was the year you could catch your fish already frozen, by the way...

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 4:31 PM

  • Shapley, Frozen fish reminds me of not all that long ago when I was at an auction and they took bids on some fishing rods. Next up was a deep freezer billed as just the thing to freeze the fish caught with the previous sale.

    An old man next to me told me that they bought a freezer when first available and froze some fish in a container of water they were caught from. 35 years later when the freezer gave up the ghost, they realized that container of fish was still in the bottem, for some reason it had became just a permanent part of the freezer for all those years.

    The point he made was that they thawed the fish and found them just a tasty as fresh caught.

    I have since several times looked back and wondered if he was "Pulling my leg"

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 4:49 PM

  • "She said he couldn't find his a** with both hands."

    or add to that... She said he couldn't find his a** with both hands (in his hip pockets).

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 5:14 PM

  • Donknome-2,

    I think you owe us all a beer at least... look how hard we have worked to prove your earliest statement wrong. ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 5:16 PM

  • Ever hear... If Bull**** was a Brass Band you would march wherever you go.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 5:17 PM

  • Never heard that one Wheels, although I was often told to wish in one hand and sh.. in the other and see which one got full the quickest.

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 6:02 PM

  • OK, WHEELS: I'll TRIPLE my original-amount of the bet---an' see ya' another, say---50-posts, that it doesn't go "sour" on us!☺

    And if I gotta supply BEER, it'll hafta be that "Super-Brilliante-Negro"-stuff---or whatever GURU called it!---since that's all she claims she'll drink!(NO, really! It's up there, in writing, about 32-posts back!) I had a round of that stuff once. Came in a little tube-lookin' thing, with a nipple on it. Guess it's good-stuff, if that's what you're into---but it tasted like shiny-black windshield-adhesive, to ME??? Stuff was brewed by some Texan, by the name of Perma...???

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:01 PM

  • I was reminded a few minutes ago about an event from the old days that shook the whole family.

    My sister ventured out of the house just after dark had set in enough to restrict her to the well worn path when that old dog that was always right charged her with a warning to go back. She continued her way to the out house and the old dog protested one last time before turning the otherway. That was followed by the ruckus of dog versus snake. When he got hold of his foe he shook back and forth so violently that he slung it into the air. That ole snake came down across Sister's shoulders and you never heard such a yeowl!

    Before the night was over, the old dog was wondering what he did wrong and we were wondering if Sis would ever calm down. I don't know if Sis ever made it to the out house that night. Maybe Grandma shared her parlor pot that night.

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:23 PM

  • Spank, I remember all sitting for a meal when a black snake decided to visit. I saw him hanging from the door facing of the bedroom door off the kitchen about the time my older brother got up from the table.

    He calmly grabbed the snake and tossed him outside while three sisters went out the other door. Mom, Dad, Grandma, and I continued our meal.

    When brother came back in, Grandma insisted he wash his hands before continuing his meal.

    -- Posted by Old John on Thu, Dec 23, 2010, at 9:00 PM

  • "Wiffle does lie about me. He was caught lying about another poster the other day. Why are you afraid to call someone who lies a "liar?" so says Spaniard.

    In response, I maintain doing so may not be adviseable for several reasons. Not never having met him in person (Wiffle), I have not been in a position to size him up. He might be the 800 lb gorilla in the room, a bodybuilder like old Arnold Schwartzhisname, as accomplish as Rocky Balboa, or a possessor of an admirable gun collection with ample knowledge in the useage thereof.

    Also as Grandfather would say you just might get your *** kicked over the silvery moon, making it adviseable to refrain from making comment. But in your case, take your chances.

    -- Posted by voyager on Fri, Dec 24, 2010, at 12:04 AM

  • The previous owner of the farm I grew up on had burried about a 100 feet of clay tile leading into the Little River ditch that crossed the corner of the property.

    I guess Dad decided to do away with the tiles since they were shallow enough that he had to plow around them.

    He offered me 25 cents for each I could dig up unbroken in my free time from other chores. I spent a whole summer on that project and when done the tiles stayed stacked down by the pond.

    All this time I spent being careful not the break the tiles, thinking he had a use for them or maybe they had great value came to a conclusion when he loaded them up and used them to stop up a gulley!

    Looking back, maybe he was just keeping me busy to stay out of trouble.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Dec 25, 2010, at 1:39 AM

  • Donk, How bout we get on the water side of the downtown flood wall and fire off our shotguns and cannons just before midnight on New Years Eve, then just about when the police and first responders and all the rest shows up, we can set off all the fire works left over from the 4th and create a show they ain't never seen. We would be heroes for "giving back" to the community. We could claim we were doing it for a charity and no one would question the 600 pounds of Charmin turned confetti that Lumpy set off to decorate downtown.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 9:41 PM

  • Greywolf...Let's see, if I recall the "Whole Nine Yards" phrase came from pilots, (don't know what kind of plane), and referred to the 27 feet of ammo that was on a canvas type belt and run through the guns. So, when the pilots talked about their combat exploits they would say, " I gave him the whole nine yards" meaning the entire load of ammo they had.

    -- Posted by Hawker on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 11:38 AM

  • OLD JOHN: How about 5-lbs. of GOEX Blackpowder, wrapped with a couple-foot of det-cord, inside of a short-piece of a 3-ft diameter steel-culvert?☺!

    I got the GOEX an' the cord, if you can find us a culvert? An', we can even stuff the Charmin in the top as well, for that "personal-signature" of us professionals...☺!!!

    (And, we'll even let RICK twist the "key" on the ignitor!☺☺☺!!!)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 7:46 PM

  • We will get you guys out of jail if it takes us the rest of our lives.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 8:58 PM

  • Donk and Wheels, I not familiar with GOEX powder but I remember a fellow telling how a farmer hired him and another kid to dig a ditch. It was on the edge of town and was to be 2'x2'x 150' or somewhere about.

    They had watched there granddad use dynamite to blow stumps and figured they could make some quick money without all the manual labor. They placed the small charges just right.

    He said they blew the prettiest ditch you could ask for and after paying for all the dynamite and broken windows, they almost broke even!

    -- Posted by Old John on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 11:26 PM

  • Now Rick, isn't that stretching a tale a wee bit beyond the realm of the believable? Although it does give you a leg up in storytelling!

    -- Posted by voyager on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 8:47 AM

  • Rick,

    Still working to prove the theory that most accidents happen at home I see. ☺ ☺ ☺ ☺

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 8:56 AM

  • OLD JOHN: GOEX is just a brand that I've found reliable, there are several others as well. (And I bet those new windows were just as pretty as that ditch was!☺)

    WHEELS: No need to waste your time! We'll get "three-hots-n'-a-cot" at least! And, besides, it'd be yet ANOTHER of our escapades to brag about---"The Great Escape", all over again!☺

    RICK: That-one almost reduced me to tears---of laughter, that is! But, if you wanted to work ol' Stretch over for some info, just leave 'im next to the stove for a few-minutes before ya' rough 'im up, an' he'd sing like a canary!☺! (Gettin' whupped by a rubba-doll! Yeah, that'd be a bit-"telling", indeed! Maybe tell 'em I'd tackled the TV, instead! BTW---I'm STILL laughing!!!)

    VOYAGER: Yeah, I think he's gonna take the prize for this year, for that latest entry!

    But then again, it ain't New Years Eve, yet---which simply means ME an' OLD JOHN, an' RICK hisself ain't been to the river-side of the flood-wall, YET....!!!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 11:06 AM

  • Mom,

    Would the fingerprinting have had anything to do with a creek?Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 7:51 AM

    Aw, darn it ... I told you about the creek? Must have been the wine affecting my brain-to-mouth activity. But no, the fingerprinting wasn't related to the creek ... ~sigh~

    donknome ... Negro Medela is a Mexican beer/ale ... Oh! And ... don't make fun of G.Mom ... she has a habit of getting even when it's least expected, you know. ~laughing~

    Never heard that ending of 'cold as a witch's tit ...', Spank. Remember, I've led a very protected life ... my mother would have fainted if I'd ever said 'tit,' so of course I couldn't ask her what it meant. Therefore, I only have ever heard 2 of the sayings on your Wed.'s list. So maybe Real-ist will tell us?

    Once again, thank you, Rick, for this thread! ... even though I'm staying behind in reading and responding ... and you're all welcome for me deleting the dozen or so paragraphs I just typed ... ~grinning~

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 6:29 PM

  • Now, that's cold ...

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 9:26 PM

  • GURU: Yeah, I figured it was somethin' like that. I never was into the "name-brand"-stuff! Well, except for that fine-quality hooch by the name of Thunderbird!(Ironically, I THINK it was, umm---"filtered-out an' cooked-off" by Bardenheier, as an "alternative-wine"?) Not bad hooch, for, I think, a buck-twenty-five per screw-top bottle? Seems I remember a Robin Hood-brand, as well, for about $2.50/gallon? Came in a plastic "milk-jug"?

    Hey, I mean---ANY ol' port in a storm, right? The bruises from hittin' the ground only hurt when ya' woke-up, right?

    Yeah, they say alcohol makes your mind numb, an' causes you to become more forgetful by the day. Wha-a-a, I don't believe that at all!!! If anything, it helped me to expand my outlook on,---uhh---umm---???

    Sorry, man---I forgot what I wuz gonna say! Budd dooon wurry---ah'll 'member it on FRIDAY, at midnight, on the WATER-side of the floodwall, with "Da-Gang"!☺☺☺!

    Which floodgate y' want for me to stagger-through, wid da' powder......???☺!!!

    (Now, don't take me TOO-seriously! I mean, after all, all it takes for me to work-up a "buzz" nowadays is a 2-liter Coke ZERO, an' a fist-full of saltines!☺)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Wed, Dec 29, 2010, at 7:19 PM

  • "An axe to grind, a bone to pick" Where'd those come from?

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 29, 2010, at 8:39 PM

  • And anudder one, "cleaner than a hound's tooth"

    My old hound's breath was so bad I never got close enough to see if his tooth was clean.

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Dec 29, 2010, at 8:45 PM

  • Old John, are you sure your old hound had any teeth left?

    -- Posted by voyager on Wed, Dec 29, 2010, at 11:14 PM

  • Why can't we rearrange the calendar, so that the New Year starts in, say, June or August ... So we wimps would be more inclined to get out and celebrate?

    Well actually, I guess people could celebrate New Year's Eve ... or even Christmas ... whenever they wanted to ...

    Or is there a law prohibiting that, along with all the other multitude of laws?

    Waiting anxiously for the stories behind Old J.'s quotes!

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 1:22 AM

  • Spank, Thanks for the link, a good read.

    -- Posted by Old John on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 7:48 PM

  • Just wondering, did anyone have some new year's eve celebration stories to share?

    I had planned on firing an and old ten guage out over the woods behind me at midnight, but the sand man took care of that. When I woke to move from the recliner to the bed I remembered I don't have a ten guage anyway.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 1:12 PM

  • Yeah---SOME-body left ME standin' on the WATER-side of the Themis-street flood gate, holdin' a 5-pound can of "FFFG"-blackpowder, an' a 15-foot-length of detonation cord, with a "hot"-ignitor in my back-pocket, lookin' for the steel-culvert that was supposed to be there! Not to mention, I couldn't find the toilet-paper that was promised.

    They must've "chickened-out", OR---did I go to the WRONG-gate???

    Either way, I had one helluva-time talkin' my way OUT of jail, this morning. But, I've learned ONE-thing from all this: STRAIGHT-JACKETS don't keep-out the COLD worth a diddly-dang......!!!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 7:58 PM

  • Donk, I heard the rumblings of a high speed chase involving one of those crotch rocket motorcycles. They hit speeds of 110mph Wednesday evening and there was chatter about a known rabble rouser.

    I figured that was you starting early since the flat-bed never showed to pick us up. :)

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 11:54 PM

  • I think you guys just may be certifiable!

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Jan 2, 2011, at 7:59 AM

  • Being certifiable, Wheels? That's what makes the whole thing fun! Seperates from the dunkelkofs.

    -- Posted by voyager on Sun, Jan 2, 2011, at 9:27 AM

  • Ha-Ha-a-a!!! Certifiable, in-deed!!!

    And I believe it even mentions SOMETHING about such "tendencies", on my Freshly-RE-Certified Birth Certificate that I got last-year, to prove to the License-Bureau that I really WAS born! (Any of us "younger-old-people" out there remember the opening-verse to George Thurogoods' "Bad To The Bone"?)☺!

    OLD JOHN, ya' know, IF I happen to still be alive NEXT-New Years Eve? That "rocket" just MIGHT-be the "ticket", fer shure!

    It's a shame he couldn't have at least used a bike that really DID "rumble", instead of "screaming like a banshee"!

    But now that I think of it: I DO have an old '45 Case VAC, that sounds pretty-good in itself, once the governor loosens-up on it...!!!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sun, Jan 2, 2011, at 10:49 AM

  • Voyager, Did Trigg wake you at midnight?

    Outside of visiting friends I have been to only one organized New Year's Eve party. That was in the '70s at Sunny Hill Motel and was billed "Top of the Hill New Year Celebration". [or something close to that] For $25 per couple they had a sound system, drinks served at your table and for I think it was $5 more you could have a room for the night. At midnight balloons loaded with prize numbers were dropped. And there was some pretty good stuff given away. After that was a good breakfast buffet. The following year the event was advertised at $125 with rooms available by reservation.

    I always wondered if the $25 price was a severe miscalculation or a misprint.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Jan 2, 2011, at 11:05 AM

  • Spank, In those days, I'm told there was a predictable pattern of bar patronage in Cape. Many would stop at Al's Midtown on Good Hope right after work. They served a great lunch so for some it was the second time there. From there a lot of folks went to Sunny Hill. I think they were one of the first places to offer complimentary spicey chicken wings at the bar.

    The regulars scattered to several different places and by 9 PM some could be found at the Library Lounge. [in the basement of the Sands motel]

    I can't remember why Sunny Hill closed but suspect it was location.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Jan 2, 2011, at 11:54 PM

  • The name 'Library Lounge' reminds me that there was once a bar called 'The Office'. The phone booth (remember those?) had a speaker that included the sounds of clacking typewriters (remember those?) and other office noises, so that patrons who called home to tell their spouses, truthfully, that they were 'at The Office' sounded as if they were at a different one.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Mon, Jan 3, 2011, at 8:26 AM

  • Old John, Trig was party ready when somebody shot off firecrackers that sounded like they went off right under our window. That really set him off. So much for an exciting New Years Eve here

    -- Posted by voyager on Mon, Jan 3, 2011, at 9:04 AM

  • And before WHEELS calls me on my bet, right-at 50-posts ago: I hereby make that promise good!

    As of right now---I am officially TRIPLING my original-bet of absolutely NOTHING...!☺!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Mon, Jan 3, 2011, at 11:31 AM

  • Donknome-2,

    253 and counting!

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Jan 3, 2011, at 4:04 PM

  • WHEELS: We gonna go for Three-Hundred, now? Be careful---we almost "lost"-it(somewhere!)back there, about a week or so ago?(Good thing we have "loose"-slots!)☺!

    Curious as to how many actually remember what the "bet"-involved, originally?

    Three-Hundred comments shouldn't be a problem---but I wonder if "The-Bet" will hold-up to the pressure...???

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Tue, Jan 4, 2011, at 9:47 AM

  • A buddy of mine in the old days was a car salesman and made the bar rounds once a week or so staying in one place just long enough to greet and meet and buy a few beers. A lot of folks remembered him when needing a car.

    It is said he always kept one eye on the door in case he had to do a quick brand rotation in case one of the beer distribitors came in.

    He had sold them both several new cars.

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 9:52 AM

  • Old John,

    I have a friend of mine who though he is older than me will not give up selling cars. I know exactly what you are saying. They are quick on their feet, I will say that for them.

    One day many years ago he brings some foreign brand over to sell me. I asked him why it had two spark plugs per cylinder. He looked, because he had not yet observed that and thought and said. well one plug fires when the piston is at top dead center and the other one fires when the piston is all of the way at the bottom.

    My comment was, Jim, Ed, Ernie, whatever name you want to use, you are full of crap. He doesn't even stutter, and comes back with, how the hell would I know, I just sell these things.

    My reply was... well why didn't you say so to begin with.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 10:11 AM

  • Wheels, Once a fellow came on the lot and Joe showed him two used cars that were about the same. He priced the first at $1,000, the second $800. The fellow looked them over and said he liked the second better but wouldn't give a penny over $900. Joe asked him if he would take it home that day if he could pull it off and returned a couple of minutes later to say the boss said ok since it was the end of the month!

    I gave him a good ribbing about that and he explained: "The last time I sold him a car he was back the next day and made a fuss about an unseen rip in the upholstry and I bought him a new seat cover out of my commission on the sale. This time I'm ready for him."

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 10:43 AM

  • Old John,

    The auto salesman I knew one time opened up a new car dealership, selling American Motors Pacers and the like. He tired of that so he sold the business, lock stock and barrel, or so he thought.

    They were in the closing room, all the paper work had been done, and the attorney for the buyer gets up, looks directly at my friend and says.... and you will have all of YOUR used cars off this lot by closing time today. The friend swallowed hard, recovered quickly and said, yes sir, I will do it. So he gathered up the titles to the used cars and with no place else to put them, most of his friends wound up with an extra car or two in his driveway for a couple of days until he found a lot to put them on and hang another sign.

    True Story.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 4:01 PM

  • Note to Spank,

    Quit thinking logically when dealing with wife. It will only cause you trouble.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 4:03 PM

  • Glad to see this thread still alive!

    Happy New Year everyone ... Okay, I'm late, but still ... I really was thinking about you all ... honest.

    Listen, donkno ... If the temperature is below about 65 or 70, I do my darndest to stay inside! Doesn't always work ... and I was a lot tougher about it in my younger years ...

    Or maybe being younger was just so much more fun that the weather wasn't a consideration?

    Wheels ... a few weeks ago I found The Picture, which had been lost for a decade. Now it's lost again ... the one and only picture of me 'at work' in Springfield.

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 5:06 AM

  • Mom,

    I have found at this time of life, it is much easier to loose things than it is to find them.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 9:49 AM

  • GURU: Less than 65-70? As in, winter-season? Honest to God, here: I fight to keep MY-indoor temps right at 65, plus-or-minus a couple.(Discourages people from visiting, that way! I don't like "human"-people---they SCARE me!☺)

    But at least at these temps---it snows less INSIDE, than OUT!

    Especially in the upstairs-rooms. All I need up there is a dustpan, instead of a corn-scoop...!!!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 10:31 AM

  • Hmmm ... That made me think (unusual for me) ...

    In the winter, I try to keep the temperature in the house between 65-70; in the summer, 75 or so.

    So, in view of my dislike of cold ... Wouldn't one think I'd keep the furnace at full blast in the winter time? Still ... prefer to not to even have AC at all, but ... somehow my one vote is over-rode by Pops' one vote.

    Then, it strikes me as odd that the Thermostat Wars are ongoing all year ... with me turning the furnace down in the winter, and the AC temp up in the summer ... while Pops adjusts the thermostat temps just the opposite (he prefers 80 in the winter; 60 in the summer) ... several times a day.

    Ah well, that gives us something to do with all our spare time ...

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 5:58 PM

  • Quit thinking logically when dealing with wife. It will only cause you trouble.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 4:03 PM

    Just do what she says. It is much easier and less painful.

    -- Posted by We Regret To Inform U on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 6:00 PM

  • You two!

    Is Pops the only husband in the country who has a wonderful, loving, generous, patient, understanding, totally logical wife? Did I say patient?

    Well, if he is just pretending ... he keeps it well-hidden from me! He's no dummie, that's for sure! ~laughing~

    Remember what I posted some time ago: Patience is a virtue; catch it if you can. Seldom found in woman; never found in man.

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 7:50 PM

  • Heh, "Thermostat Wars"! I like that one!☺

    It'd make a great reality-show episode. Instead of, "Are You Smarter Than A Fifth-Grader?", we could make one, an' call it, "Are You Colder Than A Bi***?"---naw-w-w, ain't gonna waste my time! "Mr-Moderator" would pull it before ten-minutes were up!

    Reminds me of a TRUE-story, that involved a grease-covered ME, the OLD-Sanders' Hardware in uptown Jackson, and a sweet little-ol' lady who was working the counter there at the time. Been at least 35-some-odd? years ago, by now.

    It's actually a very-nice story. And, then-young Jims'-response to my request was---as that commercial puts it---PRICELESS! Now, it only SOUNDED "bad". It was actually a quite-innocent request, for a mundane-piece of equipment.

    It involved a 12-inch Double-Cut, Flat Mill-B******-File, a fist-full of ½-inch x 90-degree Female-threaded pipe ells, the same-size Male-threaded straight pipe in a 6-inch length, and four Female-threaded nipples, to cap-off same.

    To say the least---the little-ol' lady was VERY "put-off" by my "foul"-mouth! And protested quite loudly, too! But, me being the youngster of my late-20's---even though I had already lost any decency I may have been born with!---I apologized to her out of respect, and when Jim stopped laughing, I got my ells, straights, nipples, an' that "questionable"-file!(And she was always hesitant, to wait on me after that! I just gave-up, an' started serving myself from then on!)

    It just don't LOOK as funny, with the *****'s...!

    But it appears as though I've STILL told the story, after-all...!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 8:02 PM

  • Several years back, I overheard a man using the utmost foul language in response to obvious poor service in a retail establishment.

    A fellow standing nearby scolded him, saying "How dare you talk that way in front of my wife?!"

    He politely appologized saying he picked up some bad habits following General Patton on his way to Germany,.. and besides he didn't know it was her turn.

    -- Posted by Old John on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 10:11 PM

  • Love the hardware story, donkno! Had forgotten all about those ******* Files, having given up plumbing tasks (which I hated worse than anything) decades ago.

    Anyway, thanks for the laughs this late night ... I'm still waiting for my turn, though, Old J.!

    Wow! We can't say the B words on here? Ummm ... that's going a little far, isn't it, in political correctness or whatever we call censorship geared to making sure no one is offended by words that are in the dictionary and have a valid meaning ... or have words been taken out of the dictionary, too? ~sigh~

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 2:24 AM

  • PS: Rick, I think you're going to reach 300 before this thread is ended ... if it ever is!

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 2:25 AM

  • OLD JOHN: Ya' sure ya' didn't leave-out the ensuing fight-scene?☺

    GURU: I'm not sure, about the "B"-word---didn't try it! But, I'd seen the "A"-word, and the "other-B-word" get "86'd" in past-entries. And, since we ALL-here seem to still have a VERY-functional brain---it ain't gonna take a mental-giant to figger-out the puzzle, anywho!

    I was a machinist/millwright, before I had to let it go, due to a series of strokes. But I still "do"-it, except now it's only a hobby.

    Now, I honestly haven't the idea of what the "PC"-term is nowadays, for pipe-threading? Either way---unlike with our human-race---two-pipes of the SAME-"sex" threading ain't NEVER gonna screw together!(How much ya' wanna' bet I can't use SCREW on here, even in innocence?) Well, yeah, I KNOW you can weld/braze/solder them together---but it just hain't the same-'thang!

    And, btw: Nicholson-brand files can STILL be bought as a Flat-Mill Bas****, a Double-Cut Bas****, a Rough-Cut Bas****, or even a Round-Bas****, more commonly referred to as a "Rat-Tail"-type file.

    I don't know what the "Official"-name is, for the Chain-Saw files---but I call 'em "Sons-Of-A-Bi***es", 'specially when it's COLD, an' I miss a lick...!☺

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 8:54 AM

  • Donk, The debate still goes on about the "Monkey Wrench". Some say a guy named Monckey and some say because the screw the handle style of adjustable head looked like a monkey. Maybe both. Can you tell me why the faucet on the ouside of a building is called a "Bibb". I've had a Bibb key for years and until recently I've been looking for the big clock it fits.

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 11:00 AM

  • Old_John,

    The 'bib' or 'bibb' actually refers to the threaded connection for a hose. A faucet fitted with a threaded end is called a 'bib' or 'hose bib'. The combination of a hose bib and a valve is known as a 'bibcock', the 'cock' being the valve that regulates flow through the bib.

    A faucet without the threading is simply called a 'faucet', 'tap', or 'stopcock'. Sometimes the term 'spigot' is erroneously used, but 'spigot' actually refers to the part inside the cock that regulates the flow. 'Cock' may originally have refered to the handle that controls the 'spigot', but it is now commonly used to refer to the whole assembly.

    'Bib' comes from the term for drinking, so it would seem logical that it would refer to the pipe sans threads as well, but such is not usually the case.

    In Rome, they have 'taps' fitted to public fountains along the streets. They flow constantly (having no cock to stop them), and are turned downward like an ordinary bib, sans threads. They have a small hole in the top such that, if you place your finger on the outlet of the tap, water will be forced up through the hole like a drinking fountain, so you can get a drink without cupping your hands.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 11:21 AM

  • Shapley, That's plumb instresting!

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 11:27 AM

  • A true Monkey Wrench had no serrations on the jaws, and the jaws were parallel, designed for fitting square and hex bolts, eliminating the need for a full set of wrenches (it was simply an adjustable wrench, differing from the adjustable spanner (commonly known as the 'Crescent Wrench', after the popular one sold by the Crescent Tool Company). The spanner had the handle parralel, or nearly parallel, to the jaws, while the 'monkey wrench', or 'key' had the handle perpendicular to the jaws.

    The story that the Monkey wrench was so named because of a patent issued to Charles Moncky in 1858 has been around for some time, but Wikipedia claims there is evidence of the use of the term as long ago as 1840 (though, I suppose, it is possibly the same wrench, or a variation of it, which Mr. Moncky didn't get around to patenting until some years after its original release).

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 11:34 AM

  • Shap, A few years ago I bought a large can of sockets and such. In the old days a mechanic had a collection of wrenches that may be described similar to a lug nut tools. [Each socket permantly attatched to it's own handle] What I had was the first of the Snap-on Company's design of a single handle with sockets that snapped on and off the handle much like today's breaker or break-over bar. They designed a spring loaded T shaped handle that when held down would engage with the socket holder and allow torque to be applied to the nut. When allowing the spring to disengage the handle and holder, the tool became a crude ratchet.

    Mac tools was started by selling special made tools out of the trunk of a car. The S and K name came from Sherman and Koch hardware stores that sold them. I have some of the original wrenches before they were branded with the store initials.

    And yes, few folks realize that Cresent and Allen are brand names.

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 12:01 PM

  • Worldwidewords.com provides this additional data, casting doubt on the "Moncky" story:

    "In 1973, E Surrey Dane published a book with the snappy title Peter Stubs and the Lancashire Hand Tool Industry, which includes a reference dated 1807 to a firm supplying "Screw plates, lathes, clock engines ... monkey wrenches, taps." The entry in the online Oxford English Dictionary includes this but with a question mark before the date, which means that their editors have yet to verify it beyond doubt. There's then a gap until it turns up in Francis Whishaw's The Railways of Great Britain and Ireland, dated 1840; , in which he quotes Orders to Enginemen and Firemen issued by the Liverpool and Manchester Railway, dated 1837; this includes a list of tools that must be kept in a locomotive cab, including "one large and one small monkey wrench". This reference shows that the term was even then common enough not to need explaining. The term was first used in print in the US -- so far as I can discover -- in an issue of the Natchez Daily Courier for 1838."

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 12:06 PM

  • Spank, Plumbing is a mystery to me. Every time I've a question like yours, someone shoots back the question of have you checked the vent pipes. I have yet to understand hoe a vent can stop up a drain.

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 12:23 PM

  • I'm no plumber, but I can tell you that showers and baths use a lot more water in a short period of time than waching clothes or flushing the toilet. My guess is you're simply using water faster than you pipes can take it away, so it begins to back up and eventually finds an outlet into the basement.

    I gather you are on the city sewer, rather than a septic system, since you say the city came out, but you don't say how many other users there are on the line, or if it backs up at other times. It's possible that the system is partially clogged somewhere downstream of your house. When we lived in town, we shared a line with a restaurant, which plugged the line with grease from time to time (in the old days, kitchens had 'grease traps' to keep the grease out of the septic lines, but they had to be cleaned regularly). The grease would reduce the line capacity and it would back up into our line. Fortunately, we had a clean-out lower than the house, so the backup would leach into the lawn rather than the house.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 12:27 PM

  • I ain't no plumber, either---but I'd say "HUNTER" is pretty-much on-target, with the downstream-pipe possibility? Maybe needs more "drop" to the pipe, due to settling of such over the years?

    OLD JOHN: "Plumb-interesting". Yeah, I caught it!☺

    And as for the drain-vent---generally for toilets---it serves as an air-pocket break, if you will, so's once the tu*d gets past the vent-hole in the drain, it's all downhill(literally!)with no suction through the commode, to slow it down. Hence, no "log-jam" at the end of the line.

    Good-advice, yes---too bad I don't follow it myself! I get a "coconut" hung in the line sometimes, and suddenly it's time for immediate-action! I use one of those black "tu*d-suckers" with the yellow handle, and the "jet-afterburner"-lookin' nose on 'em, instead of those red-rubber thangs, that just smear-it around, instead of chunkin' it thru!☺ I generally cap-off the vent, so the "harvest" doesn't end-up on my roof!

    Hmm---seems like this thread originally began with the issue of "Stow-High-In-Transit", didn't it...???

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 5:58 PM

  • "pretty-much on-target, with the downstream-pipe possibility?"

    Yes by all means check downstream.... cause we all know what runs down hill/stream!

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 7:11 PM

  • Yep! You'll find Tuesday-nights' Cabbage Surprise still waitin' for ya' down there, right where the clean-out plug comes out of the ell...!☺

    (Bring a bucket, an' a pointy-stick! I think OLD JOHN has the wrench already, from what I've heard!)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 8:06 PM

  • You should be able to estimate how far down the pipe the clog is, if you know the diameter of the pipe. Just calculate the capacity per foot, and then measure the number of gallons as you pour them down the drain, until it begins to back up.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 8:45 PM

  • Donk, When it comes to tools, I'm reminded of what a buddy told me a few years back. Said he met up with an old run around he hadn't seen in years and the guy insisted he follow him to his house for drinks and reminisce. When they got there his buddy said come check out my chrome!

    Expecting to see a motorcycle chromed to the max, he watched the guy open each drawer of his tool box.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Jan 8, 2011, at 1:04 AM

  • Heck, donkno ... I'm somewhat surprised we can see the word 'screw' now ... remembering back just after Missourian started the censoring program that we couldn't? Was kind of fun, though, trying to describe a screw in something I had posted after the word was x-ed out.

    Speaking of chain saws ... Pops gave me one for Christmas! It's only been on my Wish List for 8-9 years (kind of hate that it's electric, but don't tell him that! ... He has a gas one but thinks it's too heavy for me to use). One more reason to look forward to Spring! My friend across the street is going to be SO envious ... She's also wished for one.

    I used to know the theory behind the vent pipe, but have forgotten ... You know how you can put a straw into a glass of liquid, then put your finger over the top of the straw, and the liquid won't drain out?

    -- Posted by gurusmom on Sat, Jan 8, 2011, at 2:33 AM

  • SPANK, I don't know the particulars of your system---other than your house is about 40-years NEWER than mine.(People building NEW-housing today would KILL for my oak-timber framing!) Well, except my original piping was added on maybe, 50-years ago? Now, this is only MY-opinion, but as for paying to install a VENT-pipe at this point? I wouldn't do it, mainly from a financial p.o.v. Because I don't see where it would solve the "back-up" problem, anyway. But, like I said before: I'm not a plumber, either---but I CAN make a turd float down-hill!(Hey, GURU!!! Check it out!!! We can use TURD, now, too!☺!)And I see nothin' wrong with Cast-Iron fixtures, as long as they're still serviceable.

    OLD JOHN: What??? No chrome-plated tool-BOX, to complement such?☺

    I'm considering covering my roll-around(ok---DRAG-around, due to age!)with another fresh-coat of red-primer this spring. You know---just to keep the rust stable & solid...☺!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sat, Jan 8, 2011, at 11:32 AM

  • Spank,

    If your problem is a lack of a vent rather than a plugged up main, there is a simple solution that should not cost a fortune. There are individual vents that can be installed on each fixture. They are installed easily under counters and should be able to be installed behind showers. They allow air to enter the plumbing system from inside the home and will not allow sewer gases back inside the home. A plumber should be aware of these. They are used in motor homes where venting can sometimes be a problem. In my case there are two roof vents attached to the plumbing somewhere, but to facilitate drainage I also have three of the type vents I described to you to make draining each sink quicker, and there may be a fourth on the shower, I am not sure.

    There is also a new product on the market that I saw in an article that allows doing away with the p-trap. It is some kind of one way valve and it goes right in the drain and will allow water to drain one way but will not allow the sewer gases to come back, which is the function of a p-trap. This gadget looks like it could be problematic to me though as junk in the drain might accumulate and cause the one way valve to stick open. With the vent though, all that ever goes through it is air. This is just a side note as it would have nothing to do with your problem or the fix for it.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Jan 8, 2011, at 3:46 PM

  • Wheels, Why is it called a p-trap? Looks more like a J to me unless it's the pipes I installed that ended up looking like an S. :)

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Jan 8, 2011, at 6:12 PM

  • Old John,

    Plumbers are weird maybe? They have male fittings, female fittings, nipples, etc.

    Why would p-trap be out of place?

    I think I said.... I have no damned idea.

    After trying to assemble the old style chrome plated brass fittings under a sink, I'm convinced there is nothing but good luck holds them together. And in my case they always leak even if they do stay together.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sat, Jan 8, 2011, at 8:51 PM

  • Wheels, So many times I have went to a hardware store and said I need to connect this to that only to be told I couldn't do that.

    A few years ago a new employee of the local hardware store proved that I can. From then on I always knew who to go to.

    A while later she and her husband opened her own store. Still a go to place for dummies like me.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sat, Jan 8, 2011, at 9:39 PM

  • WHEELS: Yep, an' DOUBLE-male/female-fittings, for those REALLY off-the-wall applications!☺

    And let's also pay homage to the machinist, who "trims" his lathe/mill-settings, by using that time-tested unit of measurement known universally as "The-C***-Hair"---which naturally, varied greatly in the amounts of tolerance, as dictated by it's color!

    (GURU: Nope, didn't even try it! We MIGHT get away with TURD---but they ain't never gonna let C***-slide!☺)

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 10:57 AM

  • Donknome-2

    Norwegian Blonde, was the finest kind I have been told. It was used in humidistats until replased by nylon or plastic.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 11:10 AM

  • Spank,

    I do not know a lot about these things so far as location goes, but mine are installed in a tee directly above the drain pipe where the p-trap dumps into the drain.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 11:40 AM

  • The male-female connector terminology made sense until computer-manufacturers started using it. When talking about computer plugs, I assumed the large plug was the 'male' and the slot it fit into was the 'female'. However, the large plug was fitted with holes (9, 25, or 36, I believe), which had corresponding extensions (sometimes less than the number of holes), which were recessed inside the slot, making the slot 'male' and the plug 'female'.

    Small wonder computer designers are considered 'geeks'. Most men would consider the largeer appendage the mark of masuclinity...

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 1:33 PM

  • Congrats BC, you posted the 300th. Your prize is the coveted mill ******* award or a picture of a brass monkey, your choice. :)

    Wheels, I kind a like old instruments. A have a couple that measure humidity via a horse hair. The ones that use human hair were said to be more accurate but horse hair lasted longer, I'm told.

    I have a couple of modern in-outdoor battery powered gadgets and the old simple Taylor is the only one that consistantly agrees with the electonic ones.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 5:03 PM

  • Old John,

    I like the old instruments myself. Electrical meters etc. But if you want accuracy give me the new modern digital ones.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 5:37 PM

  • Wheels, I agree. The old Simpson bit the dust a few years back and I still miss it. Sometimes a needle fluctuation is more believable than a bunch of digital numbers changing rapidly back and forth.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 5:49 PM

  • Step number 1 for any plumbing project- fill up the gas tank.

    -- Posted by dr.pob on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 6:57 PM

  • BC, We moved from our house of 37 years right before the big ice storm. The power outage resulted in freeze damage to the pump and I saw no urgency to restore water to the house until warmer weather. The realtor thought we may have a gas leak and I was beginning to agree. The gas company tech. thought so too but his halogen detector said no. The odor was sewer gas due to the traps dried out.

    My second house which is older than the first has a couple of vents that terminate in the attic. I take it those are above the trap vents?

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 8:15 PM

  • Just a note.

    Spank's lack of a reply to posts directed at his plumbing problem, are undoubtedly due to two deaths in his family over the weekend. His brother and an aunt.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 9:43 PM

  • My condolences.

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 10:00 PM

  • My second house which is older than the first has a couple of vents that terminate in the attic. I take it those are above the trap vents?

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 8:15 PM

    Old John,

    It would seem to me that you could conceivably get odors from these if they are open vents, and unless you have an extremely drafty attic. The plumbing vents I am familiar with on older homes ran through the roof and terminated outdoors.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 10:09 PM

  • Wheels, One of the vents [now that I think about it] is for the kitchen stove fan. The other I think has to do with the upstairs tub and shower.

    This 1965 house was built with a cistern system. The holding tank is the entire area under where the car is parked. I understand that served well until the upgrade of a 700 foot well and a septic system was installed later.

    Some day I might explore the idea of turning that cistern into more usable basement room.

    I suspect BC had a hand in my first house. Anyone from that area and era knew a house built by [I think his uncle] was top notch.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 10:35 PM

  • Old John,

    I think we are talking about two different kinds of vents in this case. The exhausts on ventilation fans did terminate in the attic in a lot of cases.

    And yes several of BC's family may have worked on your home. Uncle. Dad and he also could have. Same guy built a house for my parents in the 1950's. The family built quality homes.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 10:50 PM

  • Wheels, I remember the big thing in the '50s next to the lightning rods was storm windows that had nothing to do with energy savings but protection from high winds. By '65 the state of the art was inside windows and storm windows mated and installed in new construction.

    We had those replaced recently.

    I guess my point is that some of the old ways are still the best ways, but some of the new ways are better too.

    -- Posted by Old John on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 11:12 PM

  • Old John,

    The 50's were the days of "Storm Boxing" your home for strength and oak lumber. Probably be difficult to find a carpenter qualified to drive nails into that oak these days.

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Mon, Jan 10, 2011, at 8:55 AM

  • Wheels, I'm thinking I have heard some old timers brag about the strength of a tupelo framed house too.

    I do know that the nails in oak are near impossible to pull out after 50 years.

    -- Posted by Old John on Mon, Jan 10, 2011, at 9:15 AM

  • Spank, so sorry for your loss.

    -- Posted by Turnip on Mon, Jan 10, 2011, at 10:06 AM

  • Spank, Our condolences as well.

    -- Posted by Old John on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 12:18 AM

  • On another thread, Shapley used the term "get their goat". From where did that phrase come?

    -- Posted by Old John on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 11:17 AM

  • According to the Sun Newspaper, the term 'get your goat' is as follows:

    "This comes from the practice of keeping a goat in a stable with a racehorse as a companion. If you wanted to nobble a horse before a race, you would steal their goat to upset them."

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 11:50 AM

  • Shap, I guess the easy way to get one's goat would be to pull the wool over his eyes.

    -- Posted by Old John on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 1:26 PM

  • Spank, Could you then call a blind man's bluff?

    -- Posted by Old John on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 4:31 PM

  • Oh! I always thought the game was called 'Blind man in the buff'! Imagine my embarrassment!

    -- Posted by Shapley Hunter on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 8:22 PM

  • I honestly did not think it would make anywhere near the present-total of posts, without "IT" rearing it's ugly-head! Came close a few-times, but "IT" never took root!

    Of course, since we've all bragged about such now, that'll probably jinx it!

    -- Posted by donknome-2 on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 9:40 AM

  • Cheers to Rick on his day!!!

    -- Posted by Have_Wheels_Will_Travel on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 9:50 AM

  • I was wondering if I have a namesake in an original Cheap John. I've heard the guy was into Army surplus. There is also a story of a guy at Brownwood Mo. that resold discarded stuff salvaged from scrap piles real cheap. Not sure if he sold to scapes though.

    I had an uncle that was so cheap that if a pay toilet cost a nickle, he'd find a way to throw it up.

    -- Posted by Old John on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 10:01 AM

  • Another one that is hard to track down: "Cold feet"

    I've heard it mostly applied to describe a business deal as in "He got cold feet" and backed out of a deal before it was finalized.

    I've got cold feet literally tonight, hands too. I may have to let her bring in another lump of coal and another dog before the night's over.

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 12:12 AM

  • Sometimes, all to often, "cold feet" occur AFTER the marriage as well!

    -- Posted by voyager on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 10:33 AM

  • Spank, I noticed referrence to a story of someone electing to take a longer alternate route to a winter river crossing due to cold feet, not having the courage to wade in.

    However that was after Maggie.

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 12:47 PM

  • Maybe he got cold feet because he was just "all tuckered out". Did someone named Tucker get famous for getting tired?

    -- Posted by Old John on Fri, Apr 29, 2011, at 12:02 AM

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