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Speak Out 8/8/08Friday, August 8, 2008
Faulty test Oh, yes, let's blame the discrepancy between our students A's and B's on report cards and their barely passing MAP scores on the teachers. How ridiculous. Maybe this discrepancy points to a faulty test, not a faulty school district. Good odds Since so many people are upset about not getting to gamble in Cape Girardeau, just give me your money and I might double it. The odds are 50-50, much better than a casino. Slated to fail REGARDING MAP scores: Student report-card grades and MAP scores should be correlated. However, each year school districts must perform a step above what they obtained the year before. Remember, we are shooting for 100 percent of our children getting a perfect score, as set by No Child Left Behind. Your district might have done a great job, but it is only rewarded by raising the stakes next year. As the goal gets closer and closer to 100 percent, more and more schools will fail. Empty streets? Wow. If Sikeston outlaws baggy, saggy pants, the streets will be eerily empty. Iraq's oil profits A recent national report said that Iraq has $80 billion in surplus money from its oil exports. We're wasting taxpayer money getting young people killed while trying to help set up a government for a country that doesn't want us there. Changing the date The date for German Days in Chaffee has moved around several times due to Kelso Summerfest and the Sikeston Bootheel Rodeo. Ever since Kelso dropped Summerfest, German Days was moved to the first weekend in August versus the second. This had nothing to do with any candidate running for political office. Election choices Term limits are ridiculous. If an officeholder is doing a great job, why force him out? If he is doing things inappropriate while in office, the people will have their chance to address this and replace the officeholder. That's why we hold elections. It's an opportunity for people to keep good people in office or change if they feel another will do a better job. Cycling advice I applaud those of you who have turned to bicycles or motorcycles to save on gasoline. However, you need to be aware of your place in traffic. Recently I have seen many people on motorcycles and scooters perform quite dangerous maneuvers in traffic. Riding a wheelie down a busy street isn't cool. It's stupid and endangers the cyclist. More importantly it puts other people at risk. Ride responsibly. A car with substantial mass will not be forgiving. Thanks for assistance I would like to thank the people who stopped and helped my husband when he had his motorcycle wreck Saturday night on Highway 74. We appreciate your following the car that caused the accident and having the driver return to the scene. You don't know how much this meant to us. Breaking the cycle I was shocked after recently reading the comment titled "School success," The main point: Lower-class (poor) students interrupt and drag down the learning process for middle-class students. In essence, it said to eliminate the problem we should place quotas on the number of students from poor families. How can this even be an option? Every citizen is guaranteed the right to an education. Those students need an education and an opportunity to break the cycle of poverty. Comments  The nature of the Internet makes it impractical for our staff to review every comment. If you feel that a comment is offensive, use the exclamation point icon beside the comment to send a report to the webmaster.
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Not to ******* base but did anyone else see the lighting of the Olympic Torch? Only in the "Land of the Firecracker" would there be such a spectacle.
Bear,
You have kids. Do you parent by fear? Do people who try to instill fear in you garner your respect or your resentment? Corporal punishment has a place. But not in the school system. If you think that is what is wrong with the schools you are sadly off base.
When I go to Mass I don't hear about "hell, fire, and brimstone". I hear about love and respect. I hear about God and prayer. I hear about Jesus and sacrifice.
I pay for my kids to get a quality education. Unfortunately I pay for your kids to get a mediocre education.
Bear,
On the new website article you said you couldn't find the main office phone number on the new website. Hope that helped. (Agree...it should have been listed on the building contact page.)
http://capetigers.com/...
bear,
explain to me why you think hitting a child with a board is effective discipline when if you hit an adult with a board it is considered assault?
Babe,
~sign~It appears, "I made a serious error in judgement" and "If you want to beat me up feel free ... I have already beaten up myself". (Don't think Edwards will mind I borrowed his words.) LOL What did you expect, he's a man and a politician ...a cheat and a liar. (Eh...present company excluded, of course.)
Hilleco
I'm so happy for your comment and I will let it stand as a beacon to idiocy.
Babe: I would get a lump in my throat if the outgoing president and the newly elected president were both on that helicopter going home to perform at a useful job. After seeing the quality of candidates offered by both parties, it is obvious that the job serves no purpose.
Miss Reagan? Hardly! Not in this lifetime.
No contest indeed! That's the reason many of us plan to vote for the two lawyers.
Re: Empty streets
Glad to see that a liberal thinking cap still doesn't fit me well and hurts my head, but whilst I was trying it on for grins and entertainment - a thought came to mind.
Suggest that the outlawing of baggy pants could be considered discriminatory and pose undue physical, emotional, and financial hardships on people. After all, some people may just be planning ahead and trying to save some money in preparation for this big obesity epidemic supposedly coming down the road.
A lot of money could be saved by just jumping right into the super-size offerings with plenty of room to grow into. Why, they're only trying to 'expand their horizons', trying to conform with a 'one size fits all' approach, and one could never attack their esteem by telling them that they've gotten 'too big for their britches'. :-)~
All seriousness aside - a wise elder once said there is one thing that many people fear more than God and the law - and that is what other people think of them. Suggest that a better approach would be to somehow figure a way to make this apparel undesirable or out-of-fashion, rather than to make it illegal with all the 'renegade / outlaw' hype that approach would offer. The 'how-to' is a whole 'nuther 'opportunity to excel'.
Babe,
Sorry, I misunderstood your post. Yes I do and will even more so this time. I first became really interested in politics when Reagan was running.
Red Rhino
I guess I was not referring to the candidates as much as our Constitutional freedom for electing office holders and chastising those who are 'bored' with the process. We can hash it out as to who is best qualified and who we want to win, but in January when that helicopter takes off with the former president we know that it has been an orderly transfer of power.
Now, tell the truth, doesn't that leave a lump in your throat, at least?
Damn, I miss Reagan.
Unfortunately Edwards has a lot of company. Seems to be not all that uncommon across both parties.
MeLange
I think even you can say 'bye bye, Edwards'. giggle
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/...
Babe,
Only speaking for myself, but for me it is the fact that I will feel no great elation or disappointment no matter who wins. There is no one running that I can enthusiastically support. Not to say I don't care, just not nearly to the extent as in the past elections.
I'm wondering why so many are tiring of the upcoming elections. It's always been uplifting to me to be part of the process. The election (s) are an affirmation of the freedoms we enjoy at the polls. Many have fallen and died to protect this very freedom and I will not diminish their sacrifice by being bored .
You know, when that helicopter lifts off with the outgoing President after the new one has been sworn in, I always cry. To me it is a renewal of faith that our Constitution allows for an orderly transfer of power.
SWBG: I mistated; Although most South Ossetia citizens carry Russian passports, they think of themselves as being independent of Georgia and Russia. Same goes for Abkazia. John McCain stated that he would welcome Georgia into NATO.
Russian stock markets dropped 4 percent on the news.
I would hope that both sides could stop th fighting and work this out without war. Wars are not good for the world's economy.
hilleco,
I was kind of thinking the same thing. Many of these countries are so unstable and the clamor to be part of NATO but as is the case with NATO armed intervention=US intervention (and pretty much US alone). I did not know McCain was in favor of this. Thanks for the info.
Babe: It's been several years since I was involved with the Libertarian Party. I don't have a clue about the party now.
SWBG: The problems in Georgia is one reason that NATO should never consider them as a member. When John McCain wanted to include them in NATO, he had no idea that he would be risking a world war. The two break away provinces in Georgia are made up of people who often think of themselves as Russian. If Kosovo deserved to break away from Serbia, those provinces definately deserve a break from Georgia, in my opinion.
This is interesting.
http://www.economist.com/...
As of 2:20 pm oil down to $115. I wonder if this is going to have an effect. Isn't Georgia oil rich as well or is my thinking off (no wise cracks please)?
Hilleco
You said you were a Libertarian. They are totally against accepting matching fed funds.
Babe: I have no idea about Bob Barr.
A little personal history of Browne and Hornberger.
Harry Browne was a gifted financial writer but was not that great at giving speeches. Harry was also a little reserved when I met him. Jacob Hornberger was just the opposite, he always felt comfortable around people. When I was in the Libertarian Party, I couldn't understand why the party didn't choose Hornberger as a candidate. There were problems at that time in the party and I opted out.
I was sorry to hear of Harry's passing.
Babe
Hopefully she will keep your grandson's interest and make it a good year for him. Some teachers go above and beyond to make sure a child succeeds and they should be appreciated for that. I am sure this same teacher would fall to critics though if she had a class where a few of the kids failed to accept what she is offering and it would be her fault to those parents.
Hilleco
Has Bob Barr been in favor or has accepted matching fed funding? I am just curious as this caused Browne's defeat within his own party.
GREYWOLF, SWBG: I just learned that the Constitution Party's candidate (Baldwin) says he wants to be a modern day Lincoln. That leaves me down to a choice of Bob Barr or not voting. There is no way as a libertarian I could vote for an Abraham Lincoln.
A longtime first grade teacher at Alma Schrader sent my youngest grandson a letter which he received today welcoming him to her class. To paraphrase her letter, she told him to begin immediately reviewing the phoenics he learned last year in kindergarten because she was expecting him to begin reading early on in her class. She means it, too, as my older grandson began reading quite well in the first semester of first grade in her class. Now, this younger grandson would rather stand on his head than pay attention for five minutes in class. But, as my daughter read the letter to him, he straightened up and began trying to pronounce the small words in the letter. He got the message, in his youth, that high standards would be set.
Thank you, Ms first grade teacher.
-- Posted by BABE on Fri, Aug 8, 2008, 1:39 am CDT
...er , Cubs baseball?
SWBG,
Yes that may be a great idea.I think we should do the same with penal institutions as well!!Privatize them.
Im off to Michigan avenue in Chicago for some shopping with Mrs.Wolf,then some Cubs baseball this weekend..
greywolf,
privatize it.
I have to agree with Hilleco!
The system is broken because everything the
Government gets involved in is broke sooner or later.
Its obvious that the school systems in this Country are in dire need of repair.One thing that might help would be to give municipalities control over their
school systems again.We have all set back and watched as the State and Federal Governments ruined the educational sysytem.
I was having some problems with refreshing and at one point I lost all postings, finally has come back.
Twiggy
Rick,
I never took an ACT or SAT either and I am not really sure I missed anything. I am not really sure how reliable of an indicator any testing is as I have seen individuals who tested well perform poorly and those who did not test well perform very well. Just my opinion not backed up any any research.
I believe test scores and educational levels are often used as bragging points and little else.
Yeah, everything disappeard on today's posts there for a bit. Sounds like the paper might be having the same problems we are having at work.
Melange,
Totally understand. Will call you in a bit.
Pups,
Looks like a very light lunch crowd (me and you)...just left you a call wave...if you don't mind, I think I'm going to skip lunch this week. (Maybe we can get together another day. Something has come up.) Oh use my cape... email address for now please.
btw...All the forum post disappeared a bit ago...then they reappeared. Not sure what is going on with the seMissourian. Having refresh issues too.
N E one else having problems with anything on here?
Good Morning all.
First, appologies for stepping toe over the line just a bit yesterday. Bad days should be days to avoid posting.
Second, Melange need a head count.
Third, Though ACT and SAT test are not manditory per say, they are if you want into college. Or at least they were back when I graduated. Most colleges had a scale of minimum score needed compared to grade point average. I did hororably on the SAT but my GPA got me into every college I applied for except one. Hateing that my SAT scores sucked took the ACT and got excepted into the College that turned me down. Though I did end up going somewhere else. It was just that they turned me down that I wanted to prove I could be there.
Nickey
yep I know that person is gone and hopefully we will get something done this year to change it for the better. Well, I might not be there as often, but grandma will.
Twiggy
OOPs sorry Rick I meant you shouldn't feel that way either. Fingers are moving faster than the brain this morning
Rick
You don't look stupid and should feel that way either. When I went to school I took an MMAT test which is now a MAP test. The ACT was completely optional and I chose to take it. Now that may have changed since I graduated 10 years ago I don't really know for sure but my mother wasn't required to take the ACT either. I have 1 sister that didn't take the ACT and also a brother that didn't and they aren't that much older than I am.
well don't i feel and look stupid ....
now i'm wondering what kinda score i woulda got
on these tests if i had taken them..
Me'Lange: We have turned the public schools over to government experiments and it has failed time and time again to better educate/train students. The children deserve better treatment than being lab rats. I realize that by making this statement that I will no longer be invited to Hillary or Teddies parties.
A child that prefers not to be a lab animal should have the opportunity to opt out. Caging children is not the answer.
Do you have numbers to back up your statement that if children were not forced to go to school that there would be more people on welfare?
Don't forget Twiggy that person is GONE!!!!! Thank God for that.
Rick
The ACT is a college entrance exam most college want a student to take either the ACT or the SAT to be accepted. I never took the SAT however I did take the ACT as a freshman in high school. Both are optional. The MAP test is required for funding for the schools.
Semo,
You are correct with that, as you said there is one particular person we have a problem with. I don't think that person should be teaching either. There mom, I and, her grandmother have went out to that school and tired to get something done butshe refuses to do things different. While I have had my grandduaghter here she has been reading on her grade level and above at times and she understands what it is. Yet they continue to tell us at school that she has no clue what she has just read about, unless they give her something several years below her grade.
Twiggy
..what exactly is a MAP and ACT test ?
i never took them and dunno what they are ...
Little_Mac,
I could be mistaken, but I believe schools (at least at the 7th-12th grade level) segregate based on abilities, interest and required subjects, in the form of scheduling their individual class selections? I know they did when I was in school 20-30 years ago.
Twiggy
That is what we go through here with the principle at the elementary. Funny thing when I confronted her and told her I felt they had placed a label on my son as being a problem she looked me in the eye said they didnt label kids but he was just one who wouldn't do it. Gee THAT was putting a label on him and AFTER I went through the state and they finally got him the help he needed he went from F's to B and C in all subjects. The ones like you are talking to just don't want to have to take the extra step and sorry but education is not the field they need to be in with that attitude.
Good Morning All
The one thing I hate about the school that my grandkids go is that they do label kids and then they don't really want to work with that child. It makes me mad that some of the kids that they have labeled as slow, aren't really slow, they are just as smart as some of the other kids. By them telling that child they are slow they are hindering their development to what they consider normal.
Twiggy
I thought it would be a good thing when our school started serving breakfast but all it is is a dollar spent on junk. After about a week the kids decided they would rather eat at home and I was glad.
Me'Lange
No they go to Chaffee. We have a list and for most days they can not take sodas or other items like that only on special days are they permitted. We still have the vending machines complete with sodas at the high school. I agree though the state or schools telling us what we can and can not let our child eat is going a little to far. I know it is over the obesity rate but sorry taking it away while they are at school isn't going to change the problem
Yes that is just the best or the sugar loaded cereals that they will let a child have as well.
semo...
Agree if the 'stuff' they are doing is distracting from the test. One would think the principle and teachers would consider the distraction factor...as the point is for the students to perform well.
semoangel70,
I am guessing your kids do NOT attend Cape Schools, because there is a 'no no' food list that kids are forbidden to take to school. Which I think is over-stepping in an area where I think the parent should be making the decisions.
Me'Lange
To a certain point yes they need something to do to relax BUT if you are in class trying to concentrate and the kid next to you is all dressed up like a clown that is going to distract you as well. Let them have an extra recess, 30 minutes in the gym playing basketball etc after each portion of the test to unwind but nothing to distract during.
Nickey
And I love the way they push a good breakfast and then the kids that eat at school get served a pop tart. here they let them bring a snack in for during the test and most of the kids bring in a soda and chips.........gee real good substance food there.
Semoangel
I too find it a huge distraction that they dress up for the test. I believe it breaks concentration and my children aren't the only ones that don't participate in the dressing up that week several parents agree that it should be for homecoming week not MAP test week.
semoangel70,
I see nothing wrong with schools attempting to enthus students to perform their best on the exams. I recall getting bored with the all the reading and comprehending, which resulted in my randomly filling the blanks dots in a pretty, creative pattern.
Hilleco, you proclaimed: "Schooling should not be mandatory. Public shooling has put itself in a position of lower expectations simply because it must educate/train those unwilling to be educated/trained."
Goodness gracious! Why don't we turn the clock back several decades when folks stopped at 6th grade educations. (mordacious sarcasm!) This is one topic I did not think you and I would ever butt heads on. I don't think many doubt the necessity of higher education in today's world...let alone a high school education.
Follow your logic down the road a few years, our society would have MANY more dependent on welfare and a much higher crime rate!
When I was in school it was the achievment test and there was no big celebration for it. Now they have the MAP test and they celebrate the thing. Pajama day, hat day, funny hair day etc. Lets see maybe if they made it about the test and not fun then the kids would concentrate on the test and scores may improve.
Faulty test: There should be no MAP test.
Slated to fail: Same
Iraq oil profits: Is Iraq willing to share those profits with prefered contractors? If not then the US will continue shelling out. There are certain political considerations and $80 billion may not cover that. Perhaps there will be another war with some other country that will provide income for those contractors.
Schooling should not be mandatory. Public shooling has put itself in a position of lower expectations simply because it must educate/train those unwilling to be educated/trained.
nickey
i think a lot of the schools have went to the progress reports. here at chaffee they get them every three weeks. The teachers are great when it comes to keeping the parents informed BUT if you have a problem with anything good luck talking to the teacher because at the elementary the battle ax in the office controls everything and she can not be bothered to help a child she just wants to stick a label on them and retain them at the end of the year.
Now as far as a kid disruppting the class not be intitled to an education
I have a son who is going into 3rd grade with severe ADHD and ODD. he is a very smart little boys BUT for him to focus things have to be different for him than most kids. He can not take a written test and pass with an A but you can verbally ASK him any question on the test and he can give you the correct answer. his reading level is that of a 5th grader. He also has a severe speech impediment. When we took the advice of Dr Robinson and went to the school to have his IEP changed to cover one on one time with test etc our principle ignored us, told us he was just a kid that didn't want to do it. We had to spend weeks fighting with MPACT and other state officials to get him the help he needed, and we pay taxes for him to get. If the school wants to label a kid why then expect that kid to perform the way they want them to. When you have two honor roll students how can they say the parents don't care when one has issues. I don't blame the teachers I blame the administration.
That is one thing I have to say is great about SC is I do get regular mid quarter progress reports on each child so that way I know how they are doing.
I guess I should add that this so far has been the experience I have had in school with my two children.
I have three kids all in school. Both of my daughters are old enough that they have taken the MAP test now. The oldest is now a sophmore, her MAP scores were always some of the highest in her class, my other daughter is in 5th grade her test scores although no where near failing aren't near as high as her sisters either. Both of the girls had the exact same teachers in elementary. How could I blame the teacher for one getting a lower grade than the other. Some kids are high achievers and some are not. This does not have ANYTHING to do with whether they are from a lower class family or not. Our school has some great teachers however we also have a principle who likes to single out students, stick labels on them, inform the parents it is a privledge for them to attend the school so they are not obligated to keep the parent informed of progress. The problem is the ones that are not in the classroom, not the teachers. Then look at the kids that are failing, do they have parents who actually care about their education and help them, encourage them etc or are they going home to an empty house to fill their time with the computer and video games instead of homework.
NO ONE PERSON can be blamed, no finacial class can be blamed, the teachers have to teach it, the student want to learn it and the parents have to support and encourage it. Any break in that sets a child up for failure.
Oh sorry forgot one more thing
Teachers are so quick to blame the parent all the time and Vice Versa. Teachers and parents alike BOTH need to stop and think what can I do to make this easier for said child. Please teachers do not just assume the parent is lazy and doesn't care. There are those of us out there that have done and are doing everything in our power to help our child but it would help if the teacher would listen and find a compromise and work with the parent instead of thinking they know better because they are a teacher. Remember you only have that student so many hours through the year while a parent raised that child and knows what works for said child. In other words "Father knows best" or
"Mother knows best" isn't so far off so please consider that before you go and think that the parent is the cause of the problem. Did you actually listen to them?
Josiah
I am going to have to respectfully disagree with you on your arguement that the environment in which a child is raised determines how good they do in school. My brother and I were both raise by the same parents in the same household and yet he was a C student while I was an A student. As Melange stated its all about the pace at which they learn. Some children have sponge brains that soak up and retain most everything that they learn while others are more like a paper towel. As Melange also stated it is the teachers responsibility to identify which LEARNING environment is best for that particular student and then BOTH the parent and the teacher determine the best course of action.
In addition, one could debate that SOME students would succeed despite the quality of teaching, parenting or enviroment.
-- Posted by Me'Lange on Fri, Aug 8, 2008, 7:12 am CDT
this is true ..some kids want to learn no matter
where they go to school...
josiah_folger,
"Remember WE do have students who are succeeding on the same test." You forgot a few very important variables--students learn at different paces and different methods of teaching work better on some than others. A few examples, some learn better with visual or audio aides, others require hands-on learning.
A teacher's responsibilities include identifying and teaching to EACH student in the most effective manner to gain positive individual academic results. To do so, a teacher must identify behavior obstacles (and other obstacles), followed with providing guidance for their students and parents on the methods to overcoming those obstacles. In other words, encourage and teach them 'how to learn'. (Of course, that is just my thoughts on what a good teacher should do.)
In addition, one could debate that SOME students would succeed despite the quality of teaching, parenting or enviroment.
good morning everyone
Empty streets?
...a lot more towns and cities streets would be eerily empty
if baggy and saggy pants were outlawed .
Los Angeles 4 , Cardinals 1
It's 8/8/08. Have a lucky day.
FYI...
Cape Public Schools have a new website: (for those who missed the announcement)
http://capetigers.com/
Building Contact Information:
http://capetigers.com/...
2008-2009 District Calendar:
http://capetigers.com/...
Events Calendar:
http://capetigers.com/...
Tiger Text Alerts:
http://capetigers.com/...
Board Policy Manual:
http://capetigers.com/...
District Report Card:
http://capetigers.com/...
TGIF! Good day all!
Off-topic: Friday Lunch, Pups...your turn to call the location!
Faulty test: If you are a teacher and don't approve of MAP's testing... please share your thoughts and legislate to the appropriate state authorities to have changes made. I personally think MAP test scores should be linked to school grades from K-12.
Slated to fail: So if I'm understanding correcting, you think it is OK to FAIL at reaching the goal of ALL students receiving a quality education?
Iraq's oil profits: Nope, not touching that one with a 10' pole.
Cycling advice:Have to agree, nearly ran over a bicycler who was riding on the wrong side of the street. (And he gave me a dirty look. Geez, maybe next time I'll just smash him like a fly.)
Breaking the cycle: I'm hoping the original comment was not serious or they did a poor job wording their point. Was thinking perhaps, the commenter meant the population of all elementary schools should be divided evenly by social-economic classifications, verses geographic location.
If this problem persist (some elementaries not making expected performance levels), it could offer a strong debate for elementary schools to be grouped by grade level attendance centers verses geographic location.